Digital Paint Discussion Board
Development => Mapping => Completed Maps => Topic started by: Chef-Killer on June 24, 2007, 04:00:29 PM
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I made this new map "Discovery - A Mission for The Future" with lots of ways and possibilities (indoor and outdoor). Each team has 2 flags. The first give 5 points, the second 3 points.
Here are the links:
Map (ftp://otb-server.de/pub/Maps/beta/discovery_b4.bsp)
Map, Mapinfo, Sky, Textur (ftp://otb-server.de/daniel/discovery_b4.rar)
All things are uploaded to the OTB server (http://www.otb-server.de).
And here a few screenshots:
(http://img111.imageshack.us/img111/2177/sshot087vb5.th.jpg) (http://img111.imageshack.us/my.php?image=sshot087vb5.jpg)
(http://img111.imageshack.us/img111/9463/sshot088em9.th.jpg) (http://img111.imageshack.us/my.php?image=sshot088em9.jpg)
(http://img111.imageshack.us/img111/4333/sshot089lp2.th.jpg) (http://img111.imageshack.us/my.php?image=sshot089lp2.jpg)
(http://img111.imageshack.us/img111/3903/sshot090pi4.th.jpg) (http://img111.imageshack.us/my.php?image=sshot090pi4.jpg)
(http://img111.imageshack.us/img111/7918/sshot091vi1.th.jpg) (http://img111.imageshack.us/my.php?image=sshot091vi1.jpg)
(http://img111.imageshack.us/img111/5403/sshot092zc2.th.jpg) (http://img111.imageshack.us/my.php?image=sshot092zc2.jpg)
PS: I hate the low BSP limits :P
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Nice map. Impossible to camp flag hehe.
There are probablysome minor details you have to fix but ill leave that to the BSP nerdys :P
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That is soooooooooooo awesome.
One thing I found:
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um... simply amazing. very, very nice job
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This map is sexy... i downloaded it and its amazing.
But some people are confused with the flags hanging off the bases.
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This map looks awesome. But Jits will have a heart attack when he sees the r_speeds. Haha.
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Awesome work chefe :) I remember beta 1 lol and now this. Good job
BUT I would say 12 points would be better then 8 :)
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Excitedly looking forward to matching on the official release asap. =]
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very good job man :)
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Jits will have a heart attack when he sees the r_speeds. Haha.
The highest I got outside of noclip mode was 5150. Eek.
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At first I thought it was the reflective water, untill I turned it off and it dropped from ~5,000 to ~3,000.
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At first I thought it was the reflective water, untill I turned it off and it dropped from ~5,000 to ~3,000.
Morning Zorch :D
With fov at 130 I get 4.8k without reflections. With fov at 100 & no reflections I get 3.6k.
Chefffff fix this!
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Morning Zorch :D
Morning. :D
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I have counted 11 ways to get to the 1 flag lol
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This map is sexy... i downloaded it and its amazing.
But some people are confused with the flags hanging off the bases.
They wondered because they couldn't grab it, hehe
At first I thought it was the reflective water, untill I turned it off and it dropped from ~5,000 to ~3,000.
Morning Zorch :D
With fov at 130 I get 4.8k without reflections. With fov at 100 & no reflections I get 3.6k.
Chefffff fix this!
Euff, i never played with fov and i don't know why it is so, but i will try to fix it.
@ViciouZ: You don't have the high res texture of the wall? ;)
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Post removed
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looks nice man.. dp needs new maps the same ones are getting old
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Awesome map this I will definitely love to have on servers but look at this screen shots r_speeds my epoly is super high.
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Apoc, I'm not sure if epoly really matters, it's wpoly that you'll want to worry about.
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Still I've had wpoly 5000 something and right there even it is 3911.
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We have played 2 matches on it and its awesome.
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very hard for teams who doesnt use ts. We played it against darkness without ts (3v3) and lost 2 times pretty badly :(.
So how many ways to go to roof atm? I counted 5 jumps + ways from base using tunnels.
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but it was a good game for the first time
and then i have a question. Is it possible if u can do this?
It would be nice if there is a 3rd way to get the 2nd flag.
(http://img409.imageshack.us/img409/8950/chefbb0.png)
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K, I have some suggestions now.
http://www.zone.ee/scythe/sshot036.jpg?2
Isnt the glass a bit too thick?
http://www.zone.ee/scythe/sshot037.jpg?2
that pole im pointing. Should be made a bit higher, so 1 jump to roof becomes possible.
6 jumps to roof atm, if that pole gets lifted, then 7 ^.^
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If this is impossible then maybe that?
(http://img444.imageshack.us/img444/770/chef2ty5.png)
(http://img504.imageshack.us/img504/5982/chefe3ep1.png)
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Discovery Jump video
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bKax3Pkq2qc (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bKax3Pkq2qc)
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One of these was in the jump videos, but I'm not sure. Are you meant to be able to do this? (demo)
edit: ignore filename
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What's the file name?
Steve.taking.skaters.mom.anal.UK.DVD-RiP.XXX.XviD
;D :o
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Again to my picutres. It Would be nice If both would work so u can come from the ice grab the 2nd and jump high out. This would be awesome and more fun
(http://img337.imageshack.us/img337/159/chefffffffzj6.png)
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MosEz, I don't think I like that idea. If he put in your suggestion, then that would become the only traveled path being that is the quickest.
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I agree with Zorchenhimer. 2nd Flag is out of the way already (and thus hard to defend), so it is already easy to get there and to get out as well. There are like 3-4 paths to the 2nd flag, if I remember correctly, so adding another, faster way would not make much sense.
On the other hand, I'd first playtest this current version extensively before making any changes.
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A 3. way to the second flag might be useful, but how zorch and pure said, the ways shouldn't be to easy or to fast. I will have a look, where i maybe can add a way (not faster than an other excist way), but i will never add ways, that you can go to the 1. flag direct, then direct to the 2. and then direct outside. I think that wouldn't make fun.
Yeah blaa, the glass is a bit too thick. I will change it for b5.
But the pole idea of you is horrible ;D. It was possible on an earlier beta, but it was soo boring, because it was also to easy and to fast. Lots of jumps loose their sence, if it would be soo easy to get high. So i decided to make this jump impossible.
One of these was in the jump videos, but I'm not sure. Are you meant to be able to do this? (demo)
To get in is easy, to get out is more hard. Maybe i will make this jump easier, but i thought, if you are low, you can come high very fast about the stone.
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http://www.zone.ee/scythe/sshot037.jpg?2
that pole im pointing. Should be made a bit higher, so 1 jump to roof becomes possible.
It is possible to jump from that pole to the roof with a little speed (demo attached). I'm not sure if that's what you meant, though. I do agree it could be made a little more accessible, though. I don't quite understand why it was made "impossible" when there are things like the barrel just to the left of it that you can jump up (also in the demo).
As pretty much everybody has said, you really need to work on the r_speeds. The framerate pretty rough on one of my machines, and I know it would be unplayable for a lot of people.
I see you've already scaled up the water texture, which should help with the r_speeds some. It has kind of an interesting effect when reflective water is disabled.
Things that need tweaking:
- When you get up on some of the high areas, you can see through parts of the wall, which looks bad (discovery_seethroughwalls.jpg)
- The sky you're using is copyrighted material from Quake2. I don't believe it's legal to use it.
- Several crate textures are misaligned (discovery_boxalignment.jpg). The light boards should be on the edges.
- When the elevator lifts up out of the ground (discovery_elevatoringround.jpg), it looks like it's still there. Shouldn't there be a hole in the ground where it came out of?
- I didn't even notice this for a long time, but there's a really thin strip of metal texture that goes along the top and bottom edge of the ledge (dicovery_thinmetal.jpg). I don't think anybody would notice if you removed these polygons to help cut down your r_speeds a little.
Great work, though. Keep it up. I'll upload it to the beta server shortly.
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Couldn't fit that last attachment on.
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you haven't even found the spot with 5200 wpoly? :P
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It is possible to jump from that pole to the roof with a little speed (demo attached). I'm not sure if that's what you meant, though. I do agree it could be made a little more accessible, though. I don't quite understand why it was made "impossible" when there are things like the barrel just to the left of it that you can jump up (also in the demo).
I am to stupid for this jump :). In the earlier beta it was soo easy, that almost everyone would go this fast direct way (that's the horrible point of the idea :D). That was just boring. But i also would say it is ok, if the jump is possible, but hard(er?), like in this beta.
The sky you're using is copyrighted material from Quake2. I don't believe it's legal to use it.
The sky was in some pack i get from this forum (i believe sth. of stigma). But if you say, it isn't legal, i will change it for b5 :'(
The r_speeds . . . I should make smaller maps :D
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But i also would say it is ok, if the jump is possible, but hard(er?), like in this beta.
After watching the jump video, it looks like it's possible to ramp directly off of the rock onto the roof, which would be faster and more direct than using the pole.
To be honest, I'm really not a fan of the "hard" jumps. They just widen the skill gap between players and make the game less fun with a mixed skill level crowd. Is it even possible to get on the roof from the outdoor area without using some kind of trick jump?
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Yap, see the demo.
Maybe the first jump isn't easy for all players, but the second way is very easy without a hard jump.
There is also the way about the ice, then about the ramp, then to the side i closed the demo, but this way goes through the other base.
And there are lots of "harder" jumps to get high, but i know, you want to see the easy ways :)
http://otbclan.ot.funpic.de/otb/Maps/Discovery/discovery_b4_easyroof.dm2 (http://otbclan.ot.funpic.de/otb/Maps/Discovery/discovery_b4_easyroof.dm2)
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Wow your map looks amazing. It sort of has a Propaint3/Midnight/Mirror2 feel to it.
The only thing I can say is, it is humongous. There are so many paths, that it seems like you will rarely ever see anyone. If used in a match, it's probably going to be one of those maps that people just keep capping flags and it is over in like 2 minutes.
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nice and funny map :D
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Propaint3
?
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Probably talking about propaint2
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Nah, he means propaint3. It's still in beta stage, but it has that feel
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Oh cool Crash is putting out a third :)
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I finished the next beta. Very thanks for the suggestions.
discovery_b5.bsp (ftp://otb-server.de/pub/Maps/beta/discovery_b5.bsp)
discovery_b5.rar (ftp://otb-server.de/daniel/discovery_b5.rar)
But there left a few things, i can't realy handle.
1. The r_speeds. I fixed and added hints (is it true that they must go into the wall 8 units?) in the outdoor area, changed the the things you said and scaled up the water. I think there isn't much to do with vis blocker without distroying the map :(. But what can i do more for lower r_speeds?
2. The part where you can see through the walls. I made the wall higher, but there are still parts of the map, where you can see through it. Are there any other possibilities to change that? Or have i to do a more higher wall, wich looks bad, i think.
3. A 3. way to the 2. flag.
(http://img254.imageshack.us/img254/2929/sshot101kl8.jpg)
In the mapfile ot this beta i have added a new way, but i have closed it with brushes, so you can't see it in the map. If i delete the brushes without adding light, there comes a max_patches error. With light of course also. I tried to scale up different textures, some textures to 10x10 just for testing, but i couldn't find a way, that the compile works (hope that in a new map format are higher or no limits :)). Are here any possibilities, that the way works? Maybe an other compiler?
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<33333333333333333333333333333333333
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ya try this its an alternative to my way ;)
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Propaint3
Oh cool Crash is putting out a third :)
Crash is going to have me finish the propaint 3 map... but ive got a few im working on i dont see it being released for quite some time
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Propaint3 should be good, i seen some screenshots and it looks tight.
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Hint brushes will only do so much. They actually create more polygons, but in doing so, if placed correctly, will break the map up so that the visibility of certain areas is removed (and thus creating fewer visible polygons). I don't think they have to be 8 units into the wall. The best way to test the effectiveness of them is to set deathmatch 0, then load the map and set gl_showtris 1. You will be able to see outlines of all the polygons drawn.
Unfortunately in your map, you've got the two biggest r_speed increasing factors combined: large, open areas and water. There's also a lot of detail, to boot. I'm not sure if there's a way to reduce them much without a major restructuring.
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Now i finished the next beta.
discovery_b6.bsp (ftp://otb-server.de/pub/Maps/beta/discovery_b6.bsp)
discovery_b6.rar (ftp://otb-server.de/daniel/discovery_b6.rar)
I changed the walls where you were able to see through.
Then i changed some textures back to size 1.0.
I also talked to sort because of the limits of the compiler. He told me how I can add the new way without getting an error, so there is the new way in this beta.
But i had to reduce the light quality a bit, I have attached screenshots with the old light and with the new light. I think it is almost the same ;)
The only thing I am not happy about are the r_speeds, but there aren't any ways to reduce them more without making a new map :-\.
This could be the final version of discovery. So please test the map ;)
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It's looking really good, the barrel plants look a little weird and unnatural though, other than that and some weird alignments, keep working on it.
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Looking pretty good I don't see much of a difference by the way how do you get past the error I hate that thing.
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Wow, I hadn't played it since beta4, sheesh I love this map. What was your inspiration for it?
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Oh, I want to make a big map (sorry, i don't want to make a map with high r_speeds :P) with two flags for each team. Then i looked for nice maps and tried to make this map from the good parts/ideas of the other maps :D
TinMan, i just know about a misaligned texture of the barrels infront of the base. Can you make a demo or screenshots of the weird looking textures, please?
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Looking good. Shame there's not much you can do to help the r_speeds without significantly changing the map. There are still some sections that look bad from the roof where you can see through parts of the wall and things flicker and and out of view (see attached shot). One small suggestion I have is to put something on the jump pads to make it more obvious. Like those arrows you have at the base entrance would work pretty well -- just put a smaller version of them on the top of the jump pad in the direction it launches you.
I can't remember if I mentioned this or not, but you can't walk through the doors while in observer like you should be able to. What entity did you use for those? Also, you might be able to use a func_areaportal on those to help cut down on the r_speeds while they're closed, but it's really hard to get those to play nice and do what you want.
I've put the map up on the beta server for testing.
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Thanks, I have to look how the func_areaportals work, but i will try to make them working.
For the doors i used func_doors targeted with trigger_multiples, that they opened earlier.
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Ah. They seem to open later than normal doors, but maybe that's just because they move slowly.
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Today and tomorrow i have time to map at this map.
So i fixed some textures and tried to add the
areaportals. But they don't work. There comes a warning, that there aren't 2 areas. I think it is because of the windows left and right of the doors. Couldn't I make them working now?
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The two 'areas' you put the area portals between have to have no way to see each other except through the areaportals. So, windows, second paths, will kill it for you.
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Argh :-\ Here is beta7.
discovery_b7.bsp (ftp://otb-server.de/pub/Maps/beta/discovery_b7.bsp)
discovery_b7.rar (ftp://otb-server.de/daniel/discovery_b7.rar)
- fixed textures
- fixed brushes (clips)
- fixed the wall (a bit)
- added the arrows on the jump pads
There left a small part, where you can see throught the walls. I made the walls higher, but it didn't fixed all. I don't know what to do for the last small part, if I do a higher wall, I get the max_patches error again :(
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Wrong link for the discovery_b7.bsp, you've linked b6.
The real link for discovery_b7.bsp is: ftp://otb-server.de/pub/Maps/beta/discovery_b7.bsp
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Thanks, fixed also.
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Umm just wondering if this is the problem I don't think so but it kight be I found that if my objects went over the sky it looked really weird and I could see everything like in brainstorm you can see objects through sky can't think of anyway to fix that though just maybe make it so high you can't see over them but that would look demented Jits might know a way though.
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err
I think my brain imploded somewhere between the second or third or fourth or fifth or sixth or seventh sentence.
There was two sentences..... mine exploded after the first line.
u said it :)
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/me punches Apoc in da nose
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Umm just wondering if this is the problem I don't think so but it kight be I found that if my objects went over the sky it looked really weird and I could see everything like in brainstorm you can see objects through sky can't think of anyway to fix that though just maybe make it so high you can't see over them but that would look demented Jits might know a way though.
Lalalaalalalaaalaa.
There left a small part, where you can see throught the walls. I made the walls higher, but it didn't fixed all. I don't know what to do for the last small part, if I do a higher wall, I get the max_patches error again :(
I know it, i will do a last try in the day. If it doesn't work, i have to live with it :'(
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For the max patches, have a look at the wiki. Find all your clip brushes, hint brushes, anything the player can't see, and scale up the texture a lot.
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They all are already scaled up to 200 ;)
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It's a good looking map, but it probably won't get played very much, except by a few German clans who like to play 40 v 40 size maps in a 3v3 match.
Most of the time huge maps like that don't get played very often.
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I actually think the map has a good gameplay in 4v4's.
What is unplayable is 3v3 in pbcup.
But i guess thats just the germans opinion then...
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Me gusta, a lot...
Will definitely be a good spot for the OTB speed server, matching would be difficult for anything smaller than a 4v4 or boring with anything greater than 30 second respawn but yeah... sweet map, keep it up
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4v4 will probably work I may put it on the DPPUG server once it's completed.
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Looking good. I've put it up on the beta server. To fix the max patches error, you might try using -chopcurve 128 (or higher) and/or scaling up some of the textures (the rock textures outside would be a good start). It would be nice if you could do something to vary the barrel-lined tunnels a bit. They're easy to get lost in.
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It's a good looking map, but it probably won't get played very much, except by a few German clans who like to play 40 v 40 size maps in a 3v3 match.
Most of the time huge maps like that don't get played very often.
Better than a 1-path-map in a 4on4
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Uh... -chopcurve 128, very high :P I am using 80 at the moment. And the rock textures are already scaled up to 2.0. But if -chopcurve 128 doesn't reduce to light quali too much, i can do this.
In this tunnels i can add some signs with this arrow textures, or what do you mean?
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About the only thing chopcurve will impact is the barrels. It tends to help a lot even if you don't have that many "curved" surfaces.
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Oh, ok then, that's nice.
For now I did a higher wall. I think and hope that the wall thing is fixed now, if not, plz tell it. In these barrel lined tunnels i have add some arrows, that people will get a better orientation. I also changed the lighting at some parts of this map.
discovery_b8.bsp (ftp://otb-server.de/pub/Maps/beta/discovery_b8.bsp)
discovery_b8.rar (ftp://otb-server.de/daniel/discovery_b8.rar)
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The arrows help a lot. Good work. About the only way you can see through the walls now is if you get on top of a barrel and jump.
Also, the new beta is up on the beta server.
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Thanks, hope that it is fixed now. I also added some entities (func_models) in the cave. There it was realy empty.
discovery_b9.bsp (ftp://otb-server.de/pub/Maps/beta/discovery_b9.bsp)
discovery_b9.rar (ftp://otb-server.de/daniel/discovery_b9.rar)
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I don't think it's possible to see over the walls anymore. I've put the newest beta up on the beta testing server for play testing. It's probably good to go. One minor thing -- with your cave paintings, the pixels in the transparent area are white, so when you move away and the texture gets mipmapped, the white pixels blur in with the black giving a funky outline. You might want to fix that. You may also want to make the paintings slightly transparent so you can see a little bit of the rock texture behind them. Maybe make a HR4 version as well, with more detail.
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I finished the map now.
Just edited some last small things at barrels, boxes and the cave texture. A HR4 version of this cave painting will come later, maybe someone can help me with that a bit.
Download discovery.bsp (ftp://otb-server.de/pub/Maps/discovery.bsp)
Download discovery.rar (ftp://otb-server.de/daniel/discovery.rar)
Serveradmins, please upload the map on your server. It is already uploaded on the OTB server.
Thanks to everyone helped me with the map / textures or gave suggestions. I am always realy happy if someone told me a nice idea for a map, because i am not so creative :D
I hope that all of you will enjoy playing this map.
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I fixed some texture and brush mistakes and added dsm barrels, that this map is playable with 5 or fewer players.
@Serveradmins: Please replace the old file with this new one. There are not enough changes for making a new map called like discovery2. It is updated on the otb and arctic server.
ftp://otb-server.de/pub/Maps/discovery.bsp
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I fixed some texture and brush mistakes and added dsm barrels, that this map is playable with 5 or fewer players.
@Serveradmins: Please replace the old file with this new one. There are not enough changes for making a new map called like discovery2. It is updated on the otb and arctic server.
ftp://otb-server.de/pub/Maps/discovery.bsp
Cool. Glad to see people updating their maps. Sorry it took me so long to get around to it, but I've updated the version on the EV1 servers. The DSM barrels are kind of confusing, though. It might be better to completely block the paths off with a solid wall.
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I worked on my maps again to fix and change some things.
- aligned one arrow texture
- changed dsm-barrels at the caves
- deleted dsm-barrels at the ice
I hope the gameplay in a 2on2 will be better with this dsm-barrels. The last version was almost a one-way map, where you were able to camp and line the doors ;)
Download map (discovery.bsp) (ftp://otb-server.de/pub/Maps/discovery.bsp)
@ Serveradmins: Please replace the old mapversion with this new file. Thanks!