--Dusk --- New Map--

[Spydie]

I took off the BSP file to edit map.

[Crash]

not too shabby, but you should have put more time into it! Maybe make some double jumps over the walls in the middle or connect the lower passage to something other than the other base =]

[T3RR0R15T]

Nice map. I've tested this map a few minutes before and i like it.

[P!nk]

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[Dirty_Taco]

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[Spydie]

Agreed it could have had some added features, I'm sure it would have had more features if my patients werent running out. I had made this map the first time, got the max_patches error so i redid the map from scratch. Got a different error, made it from scratch again. I Did a final compile to see if i would get an error, i didn't. I figured it would be a fun map to play, simple, yet fun. If you guys want, tell me what else to put in the map, i'll  put it in, and release the map as a different name. Please submit what you think would make this map more fun! Keep in mind, i didn't make shortcuts over the two middle slates (high) because then the top would be faster than the bottom. I also put those slates from the ceiling (low) to slow you down. I will make the stands for the sets of barrels (shown in second screenshot) a little bit sticking out so you can jump over the barrels. Also i am going to make one or two more ways to get low, I need help with where to put those. Please reply to this!

In my future maps, I will try to make more detailed walls (not just square brushes).

Thanks alot for your input,
   -Mike

[Spydie]

February 19th, 2006
Update: added 2 64 X 64 halls, one from Backdoor to ledge, and one from backdoor to crates. wood floor texture is not hi-res grass. new way to low under ledge. extended base for crates, can get a little more jump off it now.

[Spydie]

February 20th, 2006
Update: Added border along the top of the walls. Added lighting and entities.. I won't be able to work on it that much today. plans for the day.

Please give me some more ideas!

[Shreds]

here is an idea. dont release this till you make it good. a giant box connected to other giant rectangles isnt a map. have this be a practice map, expand on it. but dont release it till its quality

[Spydie]

what do you think i'm doing the last 3 posts. wow your'e an idiot. Did ya notice how it says "I took off the BSP file to edit map." yea.. You might want to read before you post.

[jitspoe]

I'm sure it would have had more features if my patients werent running out.

* jitspoe pictures Spydie in the doctor's office with patients fleeing every which way, "Wait!  Come back!  I need to finish my map!"

Patience is probably the word you intended.

As for the map -- judging from the screenshots (since I can't grab the file right now), it looks pretty dull and blocky.  It also looks like you may have some brush alignment issues.  Some tips:  Never use rotate.  Any brushes you've rotated, delete and re-do either with vertex manip or clipping planes.  I think S8N posted some kind of tutorial about improving bad mapping practices.  Everything possible should line up cleanly with the grid (and I mean a large grid, like 32x32 or 64x64).  Details should line up with the 8x8 grid, 4x4, or however small you need to go for them, but don't just slap everything together on 1x1 or 2x2.

[Spydie]

lol @ jits  "* jitspoe pictures Spydie in the doctor's office with patients fleeing every which way, "Wait!  Come back!  I need to finish my map!"

[Shreds]

before you get your cranky pants on and start doing the cranky dance at me, take a loot at your sshots you posted. I read you added a banner and a hallway and maybe you put some more boxes is.. but look at the layout. its a HUGE room connected by tiny hallways, correct? anywas, what i'm saying... maps are more then decorated rectangle hallways.

make the walls more interesting by adding nooks and juts (is juts the word i'm looking for?)

take a loot at a make like pbseige and notice how all the walls make you say "ohh, this map looks nice"

not all turns have to be 90degree sharp edges. rounded edges look and feel nice here and there.

dont forget to be inventive with bunkers and obsticles. Take your time and make a nice bunker here and there. Or a stupid tree that people climb.
a couple examples are the bunkers in pball_shreds1 made of coble stone. Or CanCan.bsp has the sexy spiral stairs.

Avoid things that have been done over and over. look at maps and see which maps have the same bunkers.
sandtrap has the same bunker as arctic. If you look, you will find them.

and most importantly, avoid long narrow empty hallways that a team MUST go down. imagine trying to get into the base in midnight if you could only go bottom. It makes for a bad matching map. kfields has 2 long empty hallways that meet, and even them its a camping spot for a team with leading points.

use my tips and use your cranky pants... mapping should take lots of time with lots of detail that looks good and is good on gameplay.

my examples are my first maps, tf.bsp which was WAY to big and open. I made it look somewhat good, but the game was too slow.
pball_shreds1 is pretty good, but a little jumpy.
pball_shreds2 is empty. it isnt new person friendly. It only looks okay. i made 1 good out of 4 (cant rememebr what the other one was even called). the best one is the one i put the most time into.

[Spydie]

Yeaah... you'd better catch the new one. thx for some suggestions, but i have a lot of that stuff in my new one. Please don't say "cranky pants" just sounds merry..

[Dirty_Taco]

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[jitspoe]

I think the problem with most new mappers is that they feel they should be able to whip out a map in a day and be done with it.  These people need to expand their waiting room so it can house more patients.

Part of that is how much crappy maps are encouraged by server rotations.  People think "I could make a map like this in no time!" And they can.  90+% of current paintball2 maps could be whipped out in a day or less, but we need to raise the bar a bit.  Move away from the "connected box room" designs and get some truly fun and immerse environments out there.

[BlingTricka]

not picking on you spydie but.. you need to work on those ramps that look similiar to the ones on jump.bsp  .

Those jumps slow you down a lot man.. i tried this map for a while the other day and those are just ridiculous.. i understand the anger you have after making the map over several times but hey... thats mapping.. expect the worst but hope for the best out of your project.

[Spydie]

Like i said, i allready extended them a little so you can hit the jump w/o getting stopped by the crate.

[S8NSSON]

My 2 cents on this subject....

This is from someone that has made his fair share of "connected box" maps.
In fact I can only think of four maps i've done, or am doing, that aren't based off connected boxes, chilidogs, darkages, an unreleased map, and a new in progress map.

I think the problem is that these new mappers are influenced by the indunes, pbcups, pwas, and airtimes that are out there.
We should really try to create amazing creations. Look at some of the more elaborate designs. Look at brainstorm, for instance. You may not like that map, but it's design is unique and not a box. It has cool sewer tunnels. Take example from the odd, non boxy, creation. Siege Castle is a great example. You don't have to copy, just draw influence.

Spydie that map, to me, is 100 other maps in DP. Square, flat, boring. I have a directory full of maps i've spent hours upon hours on that have never made it to the public. It's ok to learn. You don't have to release everything you work on.

I should release all my .map files so others can learn from them. Not just my released maps, but all my test maps.
I think all mappers should release thier .map files. Maybe if people wouldn't rip maps off it would happen more.

Seriously though. Don't be afraid to build, tear apart, throw away, rebuild. Place a high expectation on yourself to produce something awe-inspiring.

peace