Knack as Global Moderator

[Bix]

I am not whining, I am simply indicating that Knack isn't allowing these forums to be a place of discussion. He is locking too many threads, and is going too far in many cases.

[Dirty_Taco]

I think we should remove "Knack" from the equation and talk more about the processes and rules regarding what should be locked and what should not be locked.

Lekky, there are no 'processes' or 'rules' with respect to the forum administration. In fact there is truly nothing objective about it.

I was banned for a joke post saying 'i think jitspoe should add banana hovercrafts' for an indefinite period of time (i.e. it wasn't a '2 week' ban, but a forever ban). Bans/locked threads arise from a conflict of value systems with forum goers and forum administrators. They do not arise from posts/threads that deviate from a set of 'rules' that go along with forum posting.

I've contributed more to this community than the mass majority of its members, but that contribution has always been held irrespective of whatever post is conflicting with the value systems of the forum administration.

If saying 'well look at what knack has contributed to the community' is a relevant point in judging his forum administration ability, then it should be a relevant point if i decide to make a joke post on some newbie in the 'clans' board, for example. However, i guarantee you my contribution to the community would never cross a forum administrators mind.

I think something that is important to recognize in light of a lot of the recent discussions is that in the same way the purchasing power of the middle class fuels the American economy, (not wall street) a healthy, growing clan scene fuels the DP community.

A strong clan scene provides

1.) servers
2.) new quality maps
3.) tournaments
4.) a (usually) consistently fun method for playing this game

Severely strict forum administration is one way of diminishing the clan scene. Many of the well known, respected members of the clan scene that have had integral parts in all four of those areas do not visit the forums any more because they cannot express opinions or enjoy themselves without being banned.

While I unfortunately do not think this thread will ultimately change anything I do think it is good to see the rising number of people that want less strict forum administration. Everyone should note that this number would be much higher if so many people had not already been scared away from the forums by strict forum administration.

[Bix]

"Severely strict forum administration is one way of diminishing the clan scene. Many of the well known, respected members of the clan scene that have had integral parts in all four of those areas do not visit the forums any more because they cannot express opinions or enjoy themselves without being banned." -Dirtytaco

This quote really seems to sum up my intent. It is the same people posting over and over that are supporting the current way of forum moderating. Yet there are more total people that agree that the forum moderation is too strict.

For this game the clan scene plays a huge role in prospering of this game. It has been decreasing which is why I made a post several weeks ago to help it. I came to the conclusion this forum was not ready to help the clan scene become stronger.

[y00tz]

Lekky, there are no 'processes' or 'rules' with respect to the forum administration. In fact there is truly nothing objective about it.

That is more or less true, we have roughly five basic guidelines that rely on personal judgment.  Although, Lekky does have a point.  As far as I know, KnacK isn't doing anything wrong, he is clearly following all the guidelines for moderation, just more strictly than jitspoe and I  (which is not necessarily bad).  

Given the public outcry, I think it's perfectly reasonable to update the forum rules and guidelines, and I would support a more transparent representation of the moderators' actions.  I'm hesitant to say process, I think moderator discussion is more affective than cut and dry rules in some cases, especially when the 'correct' course of action by the rules would be much harsher than what the moderators might agree on.  I would like to see rules that don't necessarily require the same process every time, with reasonable accommodations.  For example, if Lekky, Eiii, Cobo, Dagless, DT, etc. make a one word reply, their post history and past are carried with them, and the post is clearly more valuable than a one-word post from someone who just registered.  (In the latter case, the post is usually something like 'lol'.)

I urge all of you to consider that sifting through literally hundreds of forum posts every week is an exhausting job and one that KnacK has never recently, nor in the past been praised or thanked for.   Looking through the last 20 deleted posts that I didn't have to deal with (spam, one is just titled "." and says "." in the message, and many more of the same old worthless posts). I must say, thanks KnacK.


You hard ass.

[Olbaid]

All of the mods lock threads and the creators lock them too. If I was a mod I would lock this thread because it just about some people whining just because the mods aren't doing things the way they want them to

From what I read in this thread, no one has been whining about anything.  Just because people are expressing that they do not agree with how things are being handled does not classify them as whining.  

Personally, I have been apart of a few successful gaming communities where I actively check the forums.  From my experience, it is necessary to have some guidelines/control of forum users, but I do feel that the current moderation is a little over the top.  There needs to be more balance in the way things are handled instead of the current, "cya in a few days" or immediately locking the thread.  

[Bix]

I urge all of you to consider that sifting through literally hundreds of forum posts every week is an exhausting job and one that KnacK has never recently, nor in the past been praised or thanked for.   Looking through the last 20 deleted posts that I didn't have to deal with (spam, one is just titled "." and says "." in the message, and many more of the same old worthless posts). I must say, thanks KnacK

I think Knack is too strict and is not doing a job worth thanks. It isn't the deleted posts. It is the bans for people trying to discuss or talk about a point and the locked threads that are discussing.

[dystro]

I personally think knack takes these forums too seriously, and he needs to tone it down a notch and remember that he's moderating a forum geared for mostly teenagers. 

[P!nk]

I do agree that the forum has gotten stricter (and no, I don't agree with that, hence why I didn't like the planetsuper forums very much), but I don't think the majority of the blame can be put on Knack for that happening. It was strict long before the recent increase in thread locks.

[vague312]

If you could understand my english that is probably using a vocabulary higher than your own you would understand that is what I am saying.

Oh my apologies. I didnt realize your post said the exact same thing except for the whole addressing the issue directly.

I thought your post was asking. What does he do for the community? Why is he a mod? Why is he an authority figure? Why is he a mod if he is stiiting around locking topics? (summed up the last one). did you get your answers? Yes or No.

First off this thread is not meant to be offensive or flaming, instead constructive to the wellbeing of the DigitalPaintball 2 forums.

If you could understand my english that is probably using a vocabulary higher than your own you would understand that is what I am saying.

Starting to look like someone is just trying to get a rise out of ppl for personal enjoyment.

good post above mine

[wafflez205]

I have actually seen less bans recently and yes alot of threads have been locked but most have a good reason

[Rick]

I agree with what Henrod said.

[mewa]

Seems like eveyone's ready to negotiate some new forum moderating rules and find some reasonable ground. Let this stand as a prime example of a thread which could've been locked in it's early stages, but has become very productive with a lot of well formed ideas.

Couple of quick thoughts:

Can anyone explain to me why it would be more difficult or cause more trouble than benefit to ban a "flamer" or consistently off topic poster rather than locking the entire thread? It seems to make sense to punish the individual versus the entire forum (assuming the majority of the thread is productive/worthwhile and the "ruckus is isolated to a few players).

I sympathize that the task of being moderator is time consuming, repetitive and boring as hell, and yawn inspiring. My first reaction is "get lazy?". Why is it necessary to scrutinize every post in this forum? Although it may resemble it sometimes, this isn't daycare. The fear is so deep it appears that you're all afraid to turn your back for one instant because thats surely when the freight train would come ripping through shattering all the cribs. There's this little link next to every post "Report to moderator", give people that chance to use it. I'll bet if some poster is so out of line they need to be reprimanded, someone will eventually figure out they can click on those words.


"In Vegas, everybody's gotta watch everybody else. Since the players are looking to beat the casino, the dealers are watching the players. The box men are watching the dealers. The floor men are watching the box men. The pit bosses are watching the floor men. The shift bosses are watching the pit bosses. The casino manager is watching the shift bosses. I'm watching the casino manager. And the eye-in-the-sky is watching us all. "
- Ace Rothstein



now for the individuals:

P!nk - Nice graphic. Gave some order to the conversation.

yootz - Glad to hear you're in agreement with the idea of some basic accountability rules. This should at least lessen the rage factor of those who get banned/locked. I totally agree that a set of stringent laws for the mods to follow would be counterproductive and lead to a lot of chaos. But maybe some broadly defined guidelines could be of use.

dagless o' dagless - despite what you'd rather believe I, often personally thank individuals whom contribute to keeping this game in operation. It takes a small villiage and hoards of infants to maintain this game, and everyone has a role. I've volunteered to help in many different aspects myself. Sadly, once again you've totally biffed the message. I'm starting to think you pick out all the words in a prime series and make your own sentences (pretty geeky huh). If you understood analogies, you might see that what I said doesn't conflict with what you said. It's pretty simple, watch:

1.) NO excrement SOMEBODY PAYS FOR THE SERVER AND THAT SOMEBODY CONTROLS IT.

excuse me while I remove my panties from my ass cavern.

[Bix]

I think this thread is to the point where everyone understands my point ----> Should moderation (Knack) be so strict?

[flip]

More strict on the people who just post constant negative garbage. Less strict on the thread locking but then again, who cares? DP is dying as everyone likes to say.

[lekky]

dp has been dying for a couple of years now, just like those clothes shops that have a "closing down" sale right?

[Bix]

Maybe some people like the garbage/flaming!

[Dirty_Taco]

dp has been dying for a couple of years now, just like those clothes shops that have a "closing down" sale right?

Liquidation sales = turning all your assets into cash before shut down.

I need to win the lottery, buy DP and turn it into a pro-mod.

[KnacK]

I think this thread is to the point where everyone understands my point

Sounds good.