Author Topic: My coworkers are trying to convince me I should sell Paintball2... (Read 24882 times)

jitspoe · « **on:** April 21, 2006, 01:12:26 PM »

It probably wouldn't go over well with the community to all of a sudden start charging for a game that was once free. People would probably just continue to use the old version(s). Also, it would turn it into a real job instead of just a hobby, which might not be as enjoyable to me.

I did have an interesting idea, though. Instead of charging money for the game itself, I could have a fee for global login registration. Global logins wouldn't be required to play the game, but they protect your name and clan tag, and eventually will have statistics and maybe some awards/badges for various things.

Pros:
- The game as you know it now would still be free.
- Requiring payment would reduce potential abuse of the global login system.
- Server admins could require global login accounts to play on the server, thus filtering out most of the non-serious players. Naturally, admins could set up completely free servers that don't require registrations to play, too.
- Money earned could go toward advertising to help increase the game's popularity (as well as cover the costs of the login server).

Cons:
- As I've learned from the shirts I've sold, dealing with payments is a pain, especially from people in foreign countries or kids without credit cards (or worse, both).
- I'd have to take support a lot more seriously because people would be paying customers now.
- Lots of people may be turned off by having to pay for a login account, and thus there wouldn't be enough players on the (eventual) ranked servers.

It's just an idea. Thoughts?

Smokey · « **Reply #1 on:** April 21, 2006, 01:17:26 PM »

I really would love for you to do this.. i would pay.
But it really depends on charges.

like 20 dollars a year? or 50 for like a lifetime subscription.

SkateR · « **Reply #2 on:** April 21, 2006, 01:18:21 PM »

I would never pay that much. I could see like 5 bucks heh. but I dont have a credit card and neither does my mom.

jitspoe · « **Reply #3 on:** April 21, 2006, 01:39:32 PM »

I don't like the idea of subscriptions. This would just be a one-time fee. $50 is probably more than most people would be willing to pay.

KnacK · « **Reply #4 on:** April 21, 2006, 01:41:42 PM »

Now that we heard from the peanut gallery ( skater) here's what I think.

Selling the software would be a pain due to a lack of a support structure, other than these forums.

Setting up a fee for a global login is a great idea: one fee for yearly or another for lifetime.

now...
If I were you, and were going to implement a fee structure for the global login, I would make the client and server NOT BACKWORDS COMPATABLE. When you pay, you MUST use this client and the servers MUST be at least a given level. just look at CS. 90% or better of every client update was not backward compatable and it didn't affect their user share at all. People jsut dl'd the client and played on. While server admins dl'd the updated server sw and fired up the new server.

By doing this, you will probably have a splinter faction of nonconformists, but I think they will be in the minority.

All in all, the bare minimum should be a new client and server piece that are not backwards compatible, then charge a yearly fee for stats and nick preservation.

just my 2 pesos.

JR · « **Reply #5 on:** April 21, 2006, 02:00:46 PM »

It's a good idea, and don't worry about people having a credit card because you can get gift cards almost anywhere and those gift cards have either a Visa or MasterCard logo on them to spend anywhere. I say go for it.

b00nlander · « **Reply #6 on:** April 21, 2006, 02:07:38 PM »

well, as the community of paintball is already very small, I don't think that charging a fee for this game would be useful, I think it would just draw people away from it instead of drawing people to it, as it actually needs to (look at PBCup: 9 teams only after the first season has ended, how much do you think will show up for season 2? maybe like 15 or even less... that cannot hold up with other games where there are full leagues and hundreds of people competing. Making this game as costly as those will not support things like the PBCup, and will most likely kill the community pretty soon except for the core of it.

If you only charge a fee for "stats and nick preservation" as knack proposed, that could be fine, although I still dont like the idea of paying for a game that is as old as digital paintball. But at least in that version it wouldnt have a huge impact on the community, as only the really addicted players would use that option then (which might, in the end, not even reward you for the efforts of actually setting up a system with fees).

MrRiblets · « **Reply #7 on:** April 21, 2006, 02:17:43 PM »

I like the idea about paying for the Global Login System. I would pay so my name and clan tag would be protected..

lekky · « **Reply #8 on:** April 21, 2006, 03:28:01 PM »

i'm not so certain making people pay for actually playing the game would be helpful. It may put off new players for one. I know if when i found this game it required payment, i'd just look for the next free fps around.

the global login payment thing sounds like your best bet. although again, i'm not sure if many players would take up this option.

jitspoe · « **Reply #9 on:** April 21, 2006, 04:29:39 PM »

JR: That's an interesting point. Another possibility might be to use some kind of 3rd party system to handle the sales instead of dealing with them directly. I'm sure there are some things out there like that with all of the online stores that are around these days.

b00nlander: Paying for stats and nick preservation was what this whole topic was about, not paying for the game itself. As for it being old, well, that's about like calling Counter-Strike: Source or Quake4 old. The core game is about the same, but the engine and content are being redone. I agree that the community is small, but having some cash to promote it could help a lot. Or it could completely flop, who knows?

Smokey · « **Reply #10 on:** April 21, 2006, 04:52:56 PM »

do it. I really wanna see this game take off (again?).

I love the game and i wouldent mind paying for the gbl.

You would however, need a support system and really would need to keep this forums under control

loial21 · « **Reply #11 on:** April 21, 2006, 04:54:37 PM »

Ok. So here we finally are and I first I would like to thank Jitspoe for cracking down on the forum’s flame festivusess. Perhaps now we can have open dialog with out hurtful crackbacks and dismissive behaviors based on longevity and skill be it ingame skills or writing prowless.

1. Paying for ‘official‘ server status. This is a must. It not only forces people to update as the devolpers feel they should be, but also opens up a possiblities like custom scripts for stats, forced screen shoots (like punkbuster uses) and other mentionable upgrades. This should be $50 min if not more. The higher the amount, the more responsible the admins are likely to act.

2. Global login should charge a nominal fee if you want stats and to be an ‘official player status’. Like for pbcup etc. Again the reason are obvious. The more you charge, the more likley the player will behave. However this fee should not be more than $5-10 a year. Which is totally reasonable.

To combat loosing new players or old ones as mentioned before is a concern. To thwart this have a ‘demo’ version of the game. The demo servers should be controled by a DP admins, have a very small map pack and should be entice others to play more maps, then enitce them to build up stats then hopefully become active clan memebers. This funding can be from private donations or allocations that come from fee’s the players and admin pay for. We all know, Jitspoe does not expect to make a huge profit, just a better game for us so I belive he would be down with spreading the money around.

Your thoughts?

Eiii · « **Reply #12 on:** April 21, 2006, 05:05:16 PM »

I wouldn't pay for this game. Not until it gets a lot better, that is.

jitspoe · « **Reply #13 on:** April 21, 2006, 05:12:21 PM »

eiii: Once again, you would not have to pay for the game, only a login to play on ranked servers and protect your name from spoofers.

loial: I don't know about charging money for official servers, but there should certainly be some kind of requirements so we don't have people running crappy cable modem servers, or using whacked out settings like no elim time to rapidly increase their ranking. I think the past has shown us that even if people spend a lot of money, it doesn't make them responsible.

loial21 · « **Reply #14 on:** April 21, 2006, 05:15:51 PM »

Quote from: jitspoe on April 21, 2006, 05:12:21 PM

loial: I don't know about charging money for official servers, but there should certainly be some kind of requirements so we don't have people running crappy cable modem servers, or using whacked out settings like no elim time to rapidly increase their ranking. I think the past has shown us that even if people spend a lot of money, it doesn't make them responsible.

Jits, Americas Army does it and has something called AASA. Very strick on admin abuse. Check it out. It works. I will find the link for ya. www.aaserveradmins.com. Btw I dont agree at all with your last statement, please provide a current situation in which this is so.

Eiii,
Define "gets better'. I really belive it has and is.

P!nk · « **Reply #15 on:** April 21, 2006, 05:22:01 PM »

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Dirty_Taco · « **Reply #16 on:** April 21, 2006, 05:33:16 PM »

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loial21 · « **Reply #17 on:** April 21, 2006, 05:45:36 PM »

GT servers are now admin abuse free, as well as most other paying servers. The pb cup was fantastic I expect a larger sign up and more stable clans. The euro crowd is expanding. Cheating i assume is at a all time low.

I guess when you say the game is decaying I am missing the 'why' .

Taco, that was part of what I said. BTW. You will find that 'KISS' (keep it simple stupid) works more often when speaking to non-experts rather than a complicated 'Thesis' to make a point. Over complications can bore the reader / listener if they dont have a vested intrest (or a clue) in what they are reading or listener (Oral Com 101) sadly most here dont. I would like to see that change, just like you.

jitspoe · « **Reply #18 on:** April 21, 2006, 06:08:36 PM »

loial21: I don't really want to bring up past issues, but let's just say there was somebody shelling out around $100/mo for a dedicated server and being an irresponsible admin. The current state of things is much better, but my point is simply putting a high price tag on something doesn't mean it will be used responsibly.

P!nk: I fear that may be the case. I guess the upside to that is that everybody who registers could be in the top 10 players, haha.

DT: Ultimately I'd like to have something along the lines of PBCup on a more generic level. You'd create an account, and with that account you could create or join a clan. There could then be official, self-maintained clan lists with official rosters, records and all of that good stuff. I don't know how much that would help people integrate, but it would keep things a lot more organized.

S8NSSON · « **Reply #19 on:** April 21, 2006, 06:27:41 PM »

I'm not so sure this would work.
Free and your content, and quality of, is your business.
Pay and people start demanding and getting angry (look at BF2 with it's patches and the hell people are raising about it BECAUSE THEY PAID).

And what about content?
If you are going to make money, maybe all the map makers that have put thier time into these 400+ maps floating around want a piece?
Models, skins, textures, they all need major work to get them even close to today's standards. Who's going to do these for free when you're making money (I know it may not be gobs of cash, but money is money - *bling bling*)?
Admins, and mappers, same as above (to a much lesser degree I supose).

Interest in the real piantball game is pretty high right now. I think a good advertising campagne is all that's needed. And nothin that even costs money (blast all the paintball forums).

It's not that I wouldn't pay, it's that i'm not certain I could afford to (ok...it's that my wife might not let me OK!).

And if we look at it this way:
Battlefield2: $50
SpecialForces Expansion: $29
EuroForce Expansion: $10
Total: $89

Now I could have stopped at $50 for just BF2 if I really had to. My point being I paid that money for a leading edge game with a locked in username and ranks and all that stuff. The graphics are incredible. The gameplay is absolutely great. The variety of play to keep you interested for a long long time is superb.
How could DP expect thier patrons to pay a similar ammount (the initial $50) for an extremely subpar game as compared to BF2 or anything new (Oblivion).

I love you to death Jitspoe. I respect your need for greed. But I say thumbs down on paying.
There's just not enough in this community that makes me think i'll get my money's worth.