Author Topic: Ball Speed Questions  (Read 4590 times)

m7feettall

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Ball Speed Questions
« on: May 07, 2008, 11:00:12 PM »
If I understand correctly there was a change to the ball speed setting in the game in recent builds:

http://dplogin.com/forums/index.php?topic=11965.0
http://dplogin.com/forums/index.php?topic=11143.0


I have a few questions regarding that.

A. Is that change still in place? (It appears to be).

B. Was there a feature vote that put this feature in or was it just a decision by Jits? From what I am reading so far it was not a feature vote.

C. Was a feature vote ever put in to change it back?


« Last Edit: May 10, 2008, 01:31:17 AM by m7feettall »

MrLuke

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Re: ball speed
« Reply #1 on: May 08, 2008, 07:56:27 AM »
It Changed?

blaa

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Re: ball speed
« Reply #2 on: May 08, 2008, 08:38:21 AM »
why would you change it back?

m7feettall

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Re: ball speed
« Reply #3 on: May 08, 2008, 10:11:48 AM »
MrLuke, check out this thread:

http://dplogin.com/forums/index.php?topic=11965.0

I edited the op to include that link now.

« Last Edit: May 08, 2008, 12:14:26 PM by m7feettall »

eMo

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Re: Ball Speed Questions
« Reply #4 on: May 08, 2008, 02:50:27 PM »
m7, why you do you live so much in the past....

m7feettall

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Re: Ball Speed Questions
« Reply #5 on: May 08, 2008, 03:40:25 PM »
Quote
There were several reasons.  Not sure if you remember the old ball flight and how slow the balls were - you had to aim at the sky half the time.  That was due to a limit on the max velocity.  We figured out how to get by that and I researched the velocity of real paintballs, which several sites listed as 300fps, so we set that as the ball speed.  At the time, of course people complained (I think mostly because the vets didn't have a huge advantage over new players anymore).  I think some referred to it as a railgun.  But I just figured that's the way it was supposed to be, not that familiar with real paintball.  I've been playing real paintball a lot recently, and noticed that the range of real paintballs vs the ones in the game are significantly different.  Balls will bounce off of people halfway across a small speedball field as opposed to the game where you can pick people off across the map that are up on a 20-story high ledge.  I was also annoyed at times where players could shoot all the way across a medium to large sized map and pin people in the base.  Kind of ruins the gameplay and takes away from the spirit of the game.  Paintball is more about close-range combat.  There are plenty of other games you can play if you want to shoot people across the map.

Anyway, I started looking at the code some more, and not only was the base speed high (300 fps vs 280 fps), but with the barrel upgrades, the velocity went over 400 fps.  I figured it was time to tone things down a bit, but I didn't want to have a drastic change, so I just dropped the base velocity down to 285fps for now.  I'm not sure if I'll go any further since I've been catching some flak for changing things.  I think ultimately it's better for the game overall, though.



The game is fun. It doesn't have to be real.

People who are used to the nuances of the old physics and who spent hours figuring out maps don't want to have to redo all of that. I was never that great at aiming to start with but over time I did at least learn ways to shoot in various settings etc. Why should we have to relearn all of that?

I want to just play the game and know what to expect. I don't want fundamentals to change every time someone figures out something new about real paintball. 

I hadn't seen any earlier posts on this subject until I went searching on several terms because I couldn't figure out what was different.  I kept telling my wife something changed about the game, and she thought I was nuts. Then I came across the thread linked to above.

If the feature vote is important why not use it when making a change that effects the gameplay of all of us?  Maybe it was there and I missed it. That is quite possible. That is why I am asking.

Now if I am living in the past, fine. But it is a waste of my time to re-learn old habits and who knows if it is worth it if it may  even change again in the future.  People liked the game the way it was. And every time you tweak it for some one half percent more realism you force all of us to have to change old habits, change the way we play, and invest more time.
« Last Edit: May 09, 2008, 11:14:24 PM by m7feettall »

blaa

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Re: Ball Speed Questions
« Reply #6 on: May 08, 2008, 11:03:20 PM »
 You know, lots of people got used with it with days. Yeah, some lining places were lost, but who gives a intercourse. This is a fast paced game, where you are meant to travel across the map not sit in some location and crouch and probably throw some primed grenades.

Quote
I kept telling my wife something changed about the game, and she thought I was nuts. Then I came across the thread linked to above.
pwnt

m7feettall

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Re: Ball Speed Questions
« Reply #7 on: May 09, 2008, 10:54:25 AM »
You know, lots of people got used with it with days. Yeah, some lining places were lost, but who gives a intercourse. This is a fast paced game, where you are meant to travel across the map not sit in some location and crouch and probably throw some primed grenades.
pwnt

There were plenty of people not sitting and crouching previously. And some folks still do it now.  The larger point is that we have to relearn all the spots on maps, etc. And there seems to be no assurance that it won't happen again as Jits was still toying with the idea of lowering it more.

Why should he waste all of our time that way for marginal improvement at best?


i_am_a_pirate

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Re: Ball Speed Questions
« Reply #8 on: May 09, 2008, 11:39:51 AM »
One of the main features of paintball is that the balls don't travel instantly.

The larger point is that we have to relearn all the spots on maps, etc.
So what? it gives the noobs a better chance at getting decent at the game.
there are lots of vets that are amazing at the game, and they are getting better. compared to the increasing n00bs who are also improving at the same rate, If there is something to tone down the vet (which the n00b won't really mind about), then it should happen. Not too often, but at least do something to make a level playing field. Especially on pubs...

ViciouZ

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Re: Ball Speed Questions
« Reply #9 on: May 09, 2008, 12:03:56 PM »
Look at it this way:

You've been here a long time. 5 or 6 years. Maybe the whole close-to-ten years. You have honed your skills, past the other ball speed changes of the far past. You are at the top - the best of the game. Then there is a minor change. You lose your skill - you still have the reactions, but you never hit. You have been reduced to pub-standard. All your experience with the old ball speed has rendered all your skill worthless.

You'd be pissed off.

m7feettall

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Re: Ball Speed Questions
« Reply #10 on: May 09, 2008, 12:05:16 PM »
One of the main features of paintball is that the balls don't travel instantly.
So what? it gives the noobs a better chance at getting decent at the game.
there are lots of vets that are amazing at the game, and they are getting better. compared to the increasing n00bs who are also improving at the same rate, If there is something to tone down the vet (which the n00b won't really mind about), then it should happen. Not too often, but at least do something to make a level playing field. Especially on pubs...

DP socialism? Pass thanks.  You can say you think the noobs need a chance.  But the reality is that people play a game for FUN, not frustration. Logging on and having the game changed in a fundamental way and having to re-learn is frustration.

There is no way to spare frustration for new players. There is a learning curve to any game. The nice part about such games is that once you paid the price of the initial learning curve you can enjoy the game. But when you create repeated learning curves for those already playing it is needless and ticks people off.



James

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Re: Ball Speed Questions
« Reply #11 on: May 09, 2008, 01:54:47 PM »
From what I recall, Jitspoe made the change without telling anyone like he usually did. I made a forum post some where in developing or one of them wondering why he did it. A bunch of people wondered the same thing, then the feature vote got initiated.

Nothing you can really do but take the slap in the face that Jitspoe didn't really care what we though on the matter and went ahead and "fixed the problem". The only thing really is to suck it up and adapt.

Eiii

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Re: Ball Speed Questions
« Reply #12 on: May 09, 2008, 03:18:04 PM »
While jits should have at least made people more aware of the change, you've got to accept that this game is in development. There are going to be major changes to the way it plays every so often, and you're going to have to adapt. Paintball won't go anywhere if it doesn't change.

y00tz

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Re: Ball Speed Questions
« Reply #13 on: May 09, 2008, 10:16:14 PM »
Paintball won't go anywhere if it doesn't change.

paintball to Paintball analogy, they both drop naturally, except the latter can be revived by updates.

m7feettall

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Re: Ball Speed Questions
« Reply #14 on: May 09, 2008, 11:03:50 PM »
If you tick off the current population needlessly the game won't grow because people will
From what I recall, Jitspoe made the change without telling anyone like he usually did. I made a forum post some where in developing or one of them wondering why he did it. A bunch of people wondered the same thing, then the feature vote got initiated.

Nothing you can really do but take the slap in the face that Jitspoe didn't really care what we though on the matter and went ahead and "fixed the problem". The only thing really is to suck it up and adapt.
'
Extremebain sent me the link to that thread:
http://dplogin.com/forums/index.php?topic=11143.0

I will put it in the OP.
« Last Edit: May 10, 2008, 01:30:55 AM by m7feettall »

y00tz

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Re: Ball Speed Questions
« Reply #15 on: May 09, 2008, 11:20:23 PM »
That links directly to my post, I think you want
http://dplogin.com/forums/index.php?topic=11143.0

m7feettall

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Re: Ball Speed Questions
« Reply #16 on: May 10, 2008, 01:31:58 AM »
That links directly to my post, I think you want
http://dplogin.com/forums/index.php?topic=11143.0

Ah thanks, glad you caught it.


Prime24

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Re: Ball Speed Questions
« Reply #17 on: May 12, 2008, 10:32:15 PM »
so it changed?

MrLuke

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Re: Ball Speed Questions
« Reply #18 on: May 13, 2008, 06:21:42 AM »
well us aussie laggers just pray n spray, lol
but atleast i have a new excuse for sucking :P
with such high pings from aus it doesnt really effect us,
but i can imagine there is a large change to you guys with decent pings,
id be fustrated if i learnt a map then to find out you cant shoot certain distances from different locations, but honestly i didnt notice any change.

Blitz

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Re: Ball Speed Questions
« Reply #19 on: May 13, 2008, 05:43:53 PM »
I'd have to second pretty much all of m7feettall's opinions on this particular issue.