Digital Paint Discussion Board
Development => Mapping => Completed Maps => Topic started by: Hobo on August 10, 2005, 02:51:29 AM
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Thanks to Jits, Iron and others even I have been able to put together a "map". Please take a look at it and let me know what you think. It hasn't really been tested yet so I'd like to get into a test game with it.
http://rapidshare.de/files/3831207/routes_test1.bsp.html
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Ah, this is a nice change of pace. It's a bit confusing and cumbersome to navigate if you don't know trick jumps, so it probably won't be that popular for the newbies, but it'd likely be fun for experienced players. I like the low-end weapons with a limited selection of higher-end weapons that aren't right where you spawn. The autococker room was clever - I think I liked it better before I found the secret entrance, though. ;) Had to climb through the window. Also, with the secret entrance, you need put a "translucent" flag on that brush, otherwise the vising allows for a built-in wallhack, essentially.
The center flag... maps with 3 flags don't tend to work that well. You'd probably be better off making it support 2 flag and 1 flag mode independently.
There are also a number of misaligned textures -- mostly on the barrels -- but those won't really affect gameplay for testing purposes. I've uploaded the map to the EV1 servers. Maybe loial can organize a big testing party or something as I'm going to be at a lan party this weekend.
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samples
*edit getting such,as described above
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Thank you for looking at the map. I didn't know you could get to the cocker throught that opening.... took quite a few trys but I did it once. :) The entrace to the autococker room started out as a door, but the door glowed after it was compiled. I tried the translucent tag but it also glows. How do I make them not glow? I want it to blend in with the brush faces next to it. Not much of a secret if it glows. :)
In routes_test2, I raised the sky becuse of the problem of seeing into the room through the sky. At first I tried to use hint brushes to prevent it, but couldn't totally make them work right.
In routes_test2 you can get on the roof and stuff with fairly simple trick jumps. I personally like that kind of stuff, but may need to add clip brushes to prevent it. Any thoughts from anyone on that?
I change to gamemodes so it should support everything except siege. I aligned more textures... probably still miss a few. Made alot of other small tweaks. Anyway here's routes_test2 link. Thanks again for looking at it, I'd like some others to tell me what they think also, good or bad... nows the time.
http://rapidshare.de/files/3919159/routes_test2.zip.html
(zipped/not rared for poor lialaoal) ;)
Here's a couple of sshots also.
Thanks
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From the sshot, it looks like the barrels still need to be aligned. :)
Barrels should look like:
____
|___|
|___|
|___|
The ones on the top look a bit off. Easy solution? Move the barrel up until it's aligned. Hit alt-l to lock the texture, and move it back down. :)
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Did you get all the textures aligned? :) I saw your post in loial's request thread...
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I can't honestly say that all the textures are aligned. Some of the doorway/opening tops I couldn't get to line up on both sides. I'd guess it has to do with the wall thickness and texture size. But it's not many and won't affect the game. I believe all the crates, barrels, walls, etc. are aligned.
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Ok then, where do I get the final version?
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http://rapidshare.de/files/4308251/routes.zip.html
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k, what modes does it support -- ctf and 1flag?
And what do you think would be a good min/max player count?
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Can wee set up a alpha/beta test run?
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It supports ctf, 1 flag, dm and koth, although ctf would be the default.
I'd say no more than 10 players, min 2. This would be debatable since it still hasn't been tested.
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Wee suere kould!! :o
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Hm, DM doesn't work too well -- all the spawns are still in the base.
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Add some DM spawns. ;)
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You're right, I'm adjusting and adding dm spawns, and since I'll have to re-release it I'll fix all the misaligned textures that I can find. I've already fixed most of the doorways and wall openings. Some of those rock textures are a bugger to line up. Let me know if you see anything else.
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Here is the link to hopefully the final version:
http://rapidshare.de/files/4517032/Routez_alpha1.zip.html
All textures aligned (I think), dm spawns (dm could be fun on it), and gamemodes dm, 1 flag, 2 flag and koth supported. I'd say it's a 2 to 8 player map, except dm which should support 2 to 14 or more I'd say.
Other small changes which bugged me....
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The bots are almost challenging in this map in DM mode. They were kicking my butt until I put my headphones on, lol.
Anyway, it's uploaded to the server -- I put it in the maps/beta directory. Also I renamed it to be lowercase (Linux is case sensitive, so in the future, please make all map filenames lowercase to be consistent). Maybe tomorrow night we'll have a big test fest. :)
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thanks I was about to ask , is it on mine?
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Yes, "newmap beta/routez_alpha1 <game mode>" to load it.
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hmm sez its not file not on server when I try adding, i did rename it. Do I need to create a sub folder "maps/beta" ?
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Every sometimes, you say something that makes me laugh and laugh.
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I think the top route is too fast in ctf mode. I've "slowed down" that route. I've also been working on a jailbreak for the map. Liaola did you spell the map name correctly? And follow directions to load it? newmap routez_alpha1
You shouldn't have to have maps/beta on your own pc, that's where it is on your server.
eiii, Every sometimes? ;)
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Every sometimes.
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You need to put the map in maps/beta unless you want to download it again. Then type "newmap beta/routez_alpha1" at the console.
We're planning to test DT's new map at 11PM EST, so we can test yours then, too.
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Here is the newest version, which includes a "slowed down" top middle route and uses the jailbreak function.
http://rapidshare.de/files/4806559/routez_alpha2.zip.html
maps/beta... guess that makes sense afterall...
Thx
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E i o be quiet ya boob :) At least "I" am trying, what did you do?
I was under the assumption that I could load as before ;( , mines etc....
And yes i even checked the case of the spelling. Why do I have to manually type this :( I want my friendly menu interface <<<<<<L A Z Y
Jitspoe is this a public or private test? I would like to play with a taco :-*
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Ok, now that you've slowed down the top route, the flag is really hard to get to from outside. Well, maybe not really hard, but it's a bit of annoyance, and people without much jumping skill won't be able to do it easily. When you've got all those people in jail shooting at you, it's helpful to have another route to cap. Perhaps you could lower the railing a bit or something so it can be jumped over easily? Also, are you supposed to be able to jump on the roof?
The steps under the flag are kind of a pain, too. I think it would work better if you rotated them 90 degrees and made them go all the way up to the ledge. It just doesn't flow well the way they are now.
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I was there it was fun. More work????!!!!! Perhaps one or 2 things but gj krewzer.
I vote for ar raise of height of the roof out side of cap center
Jitspoe the jump into cap is not hard, this comeing from someone that cant even clear level 2, that is to say its not the bd jump like castle1 (castlemania) has.
Or I vote for be quiet loial :)
Gj btw
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Did you try alpha2, loial, or are you talking about alpha1?
It's not necessarily hard, per se, but it's easy to screw up on, and potentially frustrating. When you have lots of people in jail shooting at you, you won't necessarily get a second chance, either.
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bah ok...i was just sayin ...
the one we played!!
the one i cant load :(
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Jitspoe,
My concern was that it was too easy to cap on the map. If you're capping the left route, through the water and then up, to the high railing side you have no one in jail shooting at you till you almost cap. That's why the railing is so high on that side. I understand you're trying to keep it easier for people who can't jump well, but that's part of learning the game, seeing people do it and learning to do it also. I suppose I could lower that rail but that would make that path the safest route for capping. It would also be a quicker escape when grabbing.
I could turn and bring the stairs up to the catwalk. Right now you can double jump to the flag from that angled wall, I think it adds a little something for the better jumpers. And you can get up to the catwalk on that angled wall. Maybe moving the steps or even adding a short ladder by the flag would help. It's not a hard jump to jump from the lift side of the catwalk over the short part of the rail to grab/cap. My goal was to make it so no route had a massive advantage/disadvantage.
Jumping on the roof was something I asked for opiniions on in a earlier post. I personally like that kind of stuff. I know there's at least a couple of places it can be done. Including doublejumping off the flag ralling. Once you get up there you're limited to that bases rooftop area and it's a great fun spot for snipers. :) The map wasn't designed intenionally to get on the roofs. I suppose in fairness to new people I problably should add clip brushes to prevent it.... opinions from anyone else?
I'll definately look at finding another easier way to cap from within the same room that has the flag. Maybe widening the catwalk to make the jump over the low rail would be enough. Maybe even another ramp in the spawn room under the jail windows up to the catwalk would offer some choice. Jail kills rule. :)
Jitspoe I know you're a busy man, I appreciate you taking the time to look at everyones maps and trying to help us with them.
Loial21 (yes I spelled it correctly), thanks for the gj ;) Raise the roof outside the cap center? Raise it even more? The only reason I see to raise it higher would be for getting on the roof... is that what you're talking about?
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I think the main problem with the stairs by the flag is that post -- I find it REALLY annoying :) It feels like when a newbie teammate keeps getting in your way. You need to either, a) make it so there's something at the MIDDLE of the steps to jump onto, b) move get rid of that post, or at least move it away from the left side of the stairs, or c) completely rework that area. Moving around in that area is just really awkward.
As for the outside path to the flag: I really think there should always be at least 2 newbie-friendly paths to the flag in any map. I think it's even more important in this one since running up that ramp is basically a death trap if there are people in jail. Since you can already access the flag that way, why not put a little ledge or something next to the railing that people can jump to without strafe-jumping?
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no sir
bah i am a crippled when trying to explain, but here i go
When going up ramp to flag I grab then strafe-jump out of base i can not get on the top ledge :(
And it was very nicely done, I like the top route :)
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Loial21,
You must be talking about routez_alpha1. If you are talking about alpha 1 then grabbing and getting out across the top route is plenty easy enough. Maybe I should just restore the flag room walkways back the way they were in alpha 1. That might help the grab/cap access problems that Jitspoe was talking about.
Since theirs so many ways to travel, I intentionally tried to make it harder to grab/cap. I was also trying to make it so someone couldn't go 200MPH. There's plenty of maps out there that you can blaze on.
Jitspoe,
I'll remove the post. :) I found it funny that it annoyed you. I think I can make some minor changes to make it easier to get in and out of the flag area.
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bah jitspoe ran the version we were playing and it was labled....maps/beta/routez..bleh bleh ....I have alpha 1 i was asked forced to download on jitspoe's server wtf im stupid ok yes .. buti cant load it....and I am using 14? :)
will make rotation....but meh...meh...!!!!!
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www.dpball.com/files/maps
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You were supposed to put it in the maps/beta directory, not just the maps directory. Also, download and look at alpha2.
Hobo: the post visually looked good, but since you have to walk up the left edge of the stairs to jump on the angled wall, it's RIGHT IN THE WAY. :) Did you use the func_getoutofjail for the jail escapes? I didn't test that part.
btw, thanks for taking the time to use clip brushes around all those little protruding edges, doorways and whatnot. I wish more mappers would do this.
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oh :)got it
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Let me know when you get those tweaks done and we'll test it again. Also, do you want to go "open source" with this map? It's helpful when years down the road you want the source to your map but lost it in a hard drive crash :) And maybe others can learn from what you've done.
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I'm almost finished with it... I've added several things I hope will make it flow better. Anyway.. it should be available later today. Releasing it open source is fine, the final version that is. Documentation will be lacking most likely ;).
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weee hurry!!!
Please make more.
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Yes the jailbreak enity is being used on this map, it's a player lets you out. The "release" buttons are clearly marked by color now.
Added/removed "stuff" in flag areas plus quite a few other tweaks.
It seems you could probalby keep "tweaking" a map forever. It seems like if you look hard enough, there's always something that might work better if done different. I suppose at some point you gotta stop "tweaking" and move on. Hopefully this map is getting close...
http://rapidshare.de/files/5272910/routez_alpha3.zip.html
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Hehe, yeah, there's always tweaking to be done. But hey, it's better to make one really good map than 20 crappy ones. :) I'll check it out when I get back home. When do we want to run another beta test?
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The 11PM Eastern Time works fine for me, that's 7PM Alaska Time. I can be there pretty much any time after 9PM Eastern.
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What day? :)
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Today!!!! ;)
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Oh, well, it's already midnight here almost. Let's test tomorrow.
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It's on wensday at 10EST. Duh.
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Tommorrow or Wednesday would be fine with me. 10PM it is ;D
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Just be sure to idle in #pbpickup. And tell others to play.
Please.
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I am in
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Maybe we should change the weekly pickup to the weekly map testing. :)
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Maptesting and playing. Sure.
In which case, we'll sneak BOKb3 on the list...
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Dearest Hobo,
First of all GJ.
Lastly, please excuse however I must say this;
I noticed some middle map, top jumps that were used by "quick" which normally I hate because i cant do :( were used.
In some popular maps this was / is used as an exploit. Now this might have nothing to due with what I am complaining about. After playing against the best q2 has to offer, I never got this mods Jumping Ability. Unless the default grav is different than the normal q2 mods which i know nothing about.
In summation, I believe a newb should be able to make any jump period anything else is a exploit.
Unless someone is hoisting up others players!!!
***Modify real time post not from when it started but when it post!!!!!
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Yeah, and take out the autococker too, because people with autocockers shoot at me.
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Well, I had fun. That was pretty crazy. I like how the jails worked out. Most of the time you'd be stuck with a pgp instead of the low end equipment that you spawn with. The jail doors in the middle are a little "glitchy" as you can get stuck/killed if more than one person tries to escape. Good job on reworking the base so it's a little easier to stay away from the jailers, as well as get to the flag. My only complaint is that it seems to have increased the r_speeds considerably. Oh, and you should put the little angled piece back on the railing. It loooked cool before, but now it looks kind of funky. I saw a misaligned crate texture near the maze entrance to the blue base -- not sure if that was the one you saw or not. Other than that it looks good.
Oh, and for KOTH mode, you need to make a hill entity that covers a larger area so the person on the hill isn't such an easy target. Mayibe make it extend to one of the boxes and barrels and stuff so people can hide. Also, you will need to make spawn points outside of the base for KOTH mode, as spawn camping can be a big problem. Maybe we'll test that next.
One last request: Move the map up above 0 on the z-axis (just alt-L to lock all the textures and move it up 256 units or so). Some framerates offer an unfair advantage with negative positions, and I'd rather avoid it by simply making sure all the new maps have no negative coordinates.
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*edit look
this should be in order of post not start time of posting
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Thank you Loial21, however I assume you're talking about the barrels by the angle bridge. I feel strongly that those must stay. I don't think everything on the map needs to be newb friendly. ;) And I think it makes it more interesting and gives more choices. I'm not a very good jumper either but I keep trying to learn those jumps and I think I've gotten better at them by keeping on trying. Looking for an advantage is part of learning the map. If you think it's a exploit then I'm sorry you feel that way. But thank you for the kind words. If you want, I'll teach you or anyone how to jump into the bd of castle1... even if I can't do it everytime, I do know how. The autococker room is another "exploit" that will stay. (eiii) :) But I do appreciate the comments.
Jitspoe thanks for testing the map and getting some players on the server. I thought it was going to be too many people for ctf but it worked out fine and it was fun.
The jail "bomber bay" door as you called them :) are set to crusher, I guess I'd better change that, plus I also got stuck for a sec on the door too... I think I have an idea how to make that end of the jail better, I'll look at it.
I opened up most of the "windows" between routes and notice a big jump in r_speeds also. I may have to shrink them back down some, and/or change/add something to break it up. The ladders, barrels, steps and such have the detail added as in brush contents. I saw you saying detail brushes shouldn't be used, I'm not sure if you mean the actual detail brush or the contents detail setting. (could do the same thing for all I know)
It's funny, I liked the rail without the angled piece better... took me a long time to align the brushes on that angle too.... haha.
A hill entity for KOTH mode, hmm... not sure what you're talking about but I'll figure it out and also move it up above 0. I thought you had to be sitting on the white flag to score points...
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The autococker room is another "exploit" that will stay. (eiii) :)
What? Autococker room? I was just making fun of loial21 for whining about things. He can't do trick jumps, and I can't kill people that have autocockers. So, they should both be taken out.
^And by that I mean NO!
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A hill entity lets you expand the area people can touch to get points. If people have to be touching the flag itself, it makes it too easy to shoot them, since you'll know exactly where they are.
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The pickup time has been changed to 9 due to popular request. :\ Just thought you'd want to know...
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Thank you Loial21, however I assume you're talking about the barrels by the angle bridge. I feel strongly that those must stay. I don't think everything on the map needs to be newb friendly. ;) And I think it makes it more interesting and gives more choices. I'm not a very good jumper either but I keep trying to learn those jumps and I think I've gotten better at them by keeping on trying. Looking for an advantage is part of learning the map. If you think it's a exploit then I'm sorry you feel that way. But thank you for the kind words. If you want, I'll teach you or anyone how to jump into the bd of castle1... even if I can't do it everytime, I do know how. The autococker room is another "exploit" that will stay. (eiii) :) But I do appreciate the comments.
Jitspoe thanks for testing the map and getting some players on the server. I thought it was going to be too many people for ctf but it worked out fine and it was fun.
The jail "bomber bay" door as you called them :) are set to crusher, I guess I'd better change that, plus I also got stuck for a sec on the door too... I think I have an idea how to make that end of the jail better, I'll look at it.
I opened up most of the "windows" between routes and notice a big jump in r_speeds also. I may have to shrink them back down some, and/or change/add something to break it up. The ladders, barrels, steps and such have the detail added as in brush contents. I saw you saying detail brushes shouldn't be used, I'm not sure if you mean the actual detail brush or the contents detail setting. (could do the same thing for all I know)
It's funny, I liked the rail without the angled piece better... took me a long time to align the brushes on that angle too.... haha.
A hill entity for KOTH mode, hmm... not sure what you're talking about but I'll figure it out and also move it up above 0. I thought you had to be sitting on the white flag to score points...
Tonight was done grrrr8 center flag....my point was more to advance jumping on any map. This is the only FPS i have seen where skilled jumping can dictate a game. Ok np, but at least have superior support for advance jumping, it does play a critical role!!!! any thing else is a cop out.
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Loial, the jumping does not "dictate" the game. In a duel between someone who can jump well, and a person who can aim, the person who can aim will win at least 75% of the time. And if you dont like being bad a jumping, practice! Load up routez and start jumping.
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I don't even consider this a jumping map. Any jumps done on it can be done fairly easily after watching someone do it. I don't see the point of making documentation for any jumps or maps. That's just part of being new at something, if you camera someone good you can learn alot about both how they play and why they are doing good. Even though Uni can be annoying, I can't count how many things I've learned from him and others just by watching how they play. You can download information about stafejumping, and doublejumping from the internet.... I sincerly believe that you think a flat map with no walls is the only fair map to play. Oh yea... you like arm and anthills. :) Maybe Jitspoe should add a grapple hook to help anyone who can't run and jump.
I'm not trying to argue about jumping in maps it's just that I don't understand how it's an exploit. Anyone in the game has the same chance to make any jump. I'd think people with a 26 ping are using a bigger exploit than jumping around a map. Think about that cowboy!! :)
Yea 1 flag was fun but the jails need to be swapped during that mode. Which means the jail buttons will be the wrong color... ARGGHH!!! :'( Where will it all end...
Koth was even fun because I was on the winning team (always more fun when you're on the winning team).
Loial21, thanks for the comments, I simply dissagree about the jumps... no biggie.
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In koth, the other team just kept getting beat back by me and someone else.
'Twas funny. 50-1
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I don't think they fully grasped the concept of KOTH. Cobo was the only one who got on the flag, I think. Hehe, they kept shooting through the windows, and I kept pgping them from jail.
As for the jumps, there's a ladder practically right next to those barrels, so if you can't jump up them, use the ladder.
One last thing -- the steps up the side of the wall to the flag capture point -- I kept getting thrown off to the side when I tried to jump up them quickly. Maybe I just suck, but it was kind of frustrating.
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Hey! I was on the flag for a long time/protected the guy on the flag until I just started pushing them back. :)
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You weren't on the red team. I meant "they" as in "the other team".
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Maybe Jitspoe should add a grapple hook to help anyone who can't run and jump.!!!!!!!
HELL YES!! (you shuold see meh grapple with my rail :) ))
Hobo lol you HPB!!! I am not asking for the mappers to show how to do such things. I am just saying its not very documented on how to accomplish such jumps in digitalpaintball this is the only q2 mod that has such jumps. Its an aquired skill that needs to be taught, becuase I know not :)
Paaaaleeease dont make me play wiht my self to learn ;(
Eio,
Your correct in the assumption that if one was confronting the other. Completely not my point gj. My point is that if one teams is able to go bd and the other is not. that is a problem, no matter how you try to explain, its nor fair.
Jitspoe,
Keep on playing with your self you'll get that jump by flag!! ;(
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Um, it's in all quake2 mods. Hell, there's even a quake2 mod dedicated to trick jumps.
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lol YOU SAID HELL
ok as I said you know to much :)
Jump MOD
I digress, I assumed these were used to hone jumping skills not to used in serious q2 ctf fps play thus giving your team in some maps an extremely unfair advantage. If you can show me one example in a played q2 map (other than dp) that uses such jumps as a serious means to shortcut to flag or camp spot, then I wil shad up. That is why they have grapple hooks and rocket jumps are for. I dont doubt you, I just have never seen them used. Sorry for the whiney rant and ingnorance, its blibe quietl.
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Here we go again... lots of changes... rspeeds are still high in a couple of spots (over 1000). Anyway, fixed some gamemode problems, changed jail doors around... check it out.
http://rapidshare.de/files/5695168/routez_alpha4.zip.html
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Jitspoe can you load this please. I would like to test it tonight.
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Heh. Jits, you should add a grapple... But just for fun. Grapple maps?
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I can upload it, but I won't be able to test as I'm heading home tonight.
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K, it's up:
newmap beta/routez_alpha4 <gamemode>
<gamemode> being ctf, 1flag, koth, or dm (It supports all those, right?)
Just took a brief look at it -- looks good. Glad you're taking the time to do it properly. It should be a lot of fun.
I need to get the new bsp pack together so you can get better lighting. Let me know how the testing goes -- we'll probably test it some more next week, too.
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thanks
Jitspoe really ...loials grapple server :)
paaaaalease!!!!!!
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awhaaaaaat? sorry hobo idk
HELP?
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K, it's up:
newmap beta/routez_alpha4 <gamemode>
<gamemode> being ctf, 1flag, koth, or dm (It supports all those, right?)
Just took a brief look at it -- looks good. Glad you're taking the time to do it properly. It should be a lot of fun.
I need to get the new bsp pack together so you can get better lighting. Let me know how the testing goes -- we'll probably test it some more next week, too.
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I am using you GUI
bah it goes in beta......
Beta GUI i have not sorry, not happening,
oversight my part,
Sorry Hobot. Make more maps u do?
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Jitspoe,
What is the cmd to load above map via rcon? or cvar? better yet via GUI!
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For the third time:
newmap beta/routez_alpha4 <gamemode>
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Loial, just learn to use console commands. Theyre not that hard...
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OK i was able to load alpha 1 not 4 via the GUI why should I not be able to load alpha 4 and not 1?
Loial, just learn to use console commands. Theyre not that hard...
Agreed
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I'm assuming the GUI is the in game menu. If you can't get that to work, then use the console login to change the map. Login and type:
newmap beta/routez_alpha4 ctf
newmap beta/routez_alpha4 koth
newmap beta/routez_alpha4 dm
newmap beta/routez_alpha4 1flag
Write it down ;)
Are you french? You're starting to type in broken sentences again. Luckily, George Bush is providing us with a grant for the study of Liolaism language. :)
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Lol.
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We can probably test tonight at around 9:30-10:00 ish, if anybody's interested. Sounds like you never got it tested this weekend. :)
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I actually don't see any changes. At all. Except for the jail bars, but that seems to be it.
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Well you just aren't very observant then.
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Hm.
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EIO,
ha! ha! (nelson's laugh)
Hobo,
I know! I know! I know!
I am from Texas so my ability to articulate in any language is stuntted.
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'stuntted', indeed.
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Stuttered as well?
Edit: sorry I didn't make it back by 10. When would be a good time to test for you, Hobo?
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We could do the pickup again...
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Some of the changes were only for different gamemodes. However.... I added a wider ledge and castle type parrapets (I'm guessing that that's what they're called). Not sure how you can miss them. :) I was trying for some blockage to cut down the r_speeds. It would be nice to test to see if it's too much in that little area of the map. All the gamemodes had at least some change to the players spawns if nothing else.
The jailbars should work better as they are now. The jail buttons are different. The button is colored instead of the area around the button. Removed about a third of the rail posts, and raise the wall between the flag and barrel area, again for r_speeds. So it may not seem like much, and it probalby isn't, but there are changes for better or worse.
Testing with the bots really doesn't provide all the in and outs so I appreciate the help testing it.
I didn't get home until late tonight (East Coast late that is) but we could test it tommorrow and/or Wednesday at 10PM. The pickup on Wednesday nights seem to work good for me, although it dinnertime about that time here.
Lioal, we know you're from Texas, that's why George himself authorized the grant. :)
Actually I've been to Texas (and most other states also) and you Texans seem almost as normal as the rest of the tiny little states.... errr.... I mean the USA!! YEEHAW!!! :) Just kidding pardner.
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Just kidding pardner.
Yeah, everybody knows Texans aren't anywhere near as normal as the rest of us. ;)
Ok, well, we'll try to get some testing done tonight or tomorrow night. Maybe both. :)
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The map testing went pretty well. I think a lot more players are needed for KOTH mode, though, or maybe that layout just isn't going to work. DM was fun. 1 flag mode needs a fix for the jail spawn. You're mean for making the last step still throw you off. ;)
The roofs you can still get on... if you keep them, you need to add a little light. I'd suggest making the sky emit a small amount of light (like moon light). Perhaps use the arghrad sun parameters with small values coming from the direction of the moon in the sky. To get the right angles, put your crosshair on the moon and type "angles" at the console -- I think I added that in build 15. If not, do it on the ev1 servers as they're running the newest unreleased code. Negate those values (just need yaw and pitch). Read up at www.planetquake.com/arghrad for info on the lighting -- best to try with a small test map so you don't waste a bunch of time compiling.
Also, with the notes of lighting. I guess the freakish glowing ooze can stay, but the other barrels with regular water should have the light flag removed (don't know why we ever made the water emit light by default...). I need to get a bsp pack together with the new .wals and stuff so you can compile it properly. As it is now, the reflected light is too bright because it's expecting q2's crappy dark textures. Maybe I'll have that together tonight or tomorrow.
I'm thinking there's something else that I was going to comment on, but I can't remember what it was.
Oh, this isn't it, but you may want to remove the dmg or crusher on the elevator so it doesn't kill people. And there were some errors on load about path_corner not having a spawn function.
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It's probably not a good map for every mode it supports, it was a learning experience just making it and fun testing it.
The 1 flag jail spawn is an easy fix.
That last step only throws you off if you run into the leading edge... come on it can't be 100% newb friendly, where's the fun in that?
The roof: There's not much to do up there anyway, and camping up there will probably cost a capture more often than saving one so I think I'm gonna leave that area accessible. I should have gotten down and looked at someone up there, is it that hard to see people up there? I probalby have my gamma turned up to high (what a exploit). The sky has a small amount of light already but I'll add some more. I haven't played with arghrad so I guess it's time to learn, I assume shadows would be possible and I think that'd be cool. I check out that link, thank you.
Glowing barrel ooze: Pfftt you're no fun.. that's radioactive nuclear fusion coolant... all paintball fields have them! I'll just use the ooze for all of them... the ooze doesn't default with the light setting. :) I like how they glow and light up the wall, I was thinking of using them for the main source of light sometime. Like Cobo's tunnels could be lit with "glowing ooze". :) Maybe not related too well to paintball, but I thought they looked good.
Crusher: I have to look at it again, I thought I had them all removed. I may have to change it to a platform to get rid of the startup error... it's was done according to Rust's tutorial, but I'll try to get the path_corner error fixed.
Thanks for the comments.
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Newb asks
"Map maker, your elevator jams then kills when I walk in to it wong"
Hobo :) ?
(gj)
Make Sense? above. ...lol Loial wed puzzle
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I was talking about the barrels with plain water in them. The radioactive waste can stay. ;)
As for the path_corner, that's an error on my part. I thought they were only used for monsters, and I deleted all the monster-related code. The real question is: how does it still work? lol. The code isn't there, but the elevator still works. Strange. I'll fix that, though. Unless there's some other entity you're using in conjunction with path_corner and path_coner isn't really necessary?
As for the roof, there is no lighting up there. Try it in build 15 which compensates for a bug in the compiler and makes it fair all around by making unlit areas actually black.
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What roof?
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The roof on top of the building. :P (It's not a secret but you can figure it out I'm sure.)
The elevator is all that's using the path_corners. I've always gotten that error but couldn't figure out how to fix it. It may not be needed, it was how the tutorial said to do it. Path_corner is used by func_train.
Loial the elevators have always killed if you ride it wrong. I tried to use clip brushes to "guide" players so it doesn't happen but I'm guessing because of the jerky action it's too much to push the players over into the center of the pad. I'll have to look at the enity to see if crusher is on. Those elevators were finished before I discovered why some spawnflags weren't showing up... I simply didn't think about going back and looking at it. Each elevator uses 7 (if I remember right) enities each. :)
Cobo you said you saw a jail wall dissapear... can you discribe what you saw? And something about climbing the walls?
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Hobo, use func_plats, so that you can use the accel/decel thing. It'll look better.
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about the climbing walls thing i saw that there was some kind of inclination on the roof of the walls next to the bases and then i saw that maybe i could jump from the rails, i tried but couldnt so thats why i asked, but i just saw that you cant because there is a clip brush(i think)
and, the jail thing i think i messed up because there are 2 levels on the jail, so i guess i saw the lower one and then the higher one.
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Can you reproduce it? Take a screenshot?
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there isnt any problem so there isnt any screenshot needed! :P
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screenshots are awsome, what are you talking about...?
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Termi, doesn't matter if you're not gonna play anyway.... ;)
Here is alpha 5:
http://rapidshare.de/files/6124292/routez_alpha5.zip.html
I don't have any screenshots right now, if you really want some I'll post some. Pball2 alpha 15 made me change some of the lighting, that's the primary changes.
Check it out, maybe we can test it again this week?
Thanks
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Sure -- we can keep up our traditional tuesday and/or wednesday map testing. :)
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I will be there there for the slaughter.
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Hm, as I feared, the lighting looks a lot better with "proper" texture colors for reflection, but now it's too dark. I wonder if there's a compiler option to just scale up the lighting brightness of all the lights. If not, I could probably make a quick program that will scale up the brightness on all the lights...
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Ok, -scale 2 makes it much better. I'm recompiling it now (with higher quality settings). I'll post the re-lit version when it's done.
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K, here's the lighter version.
BTW, it compiled with -chop 32 just fine, so you may want to edit your high quality batch file and change 16 to 32.
Full options were: -scale 2 -extra -chop 32
http://dpball.com/files/maps/beta/routez_alpha5_lighter.bsp
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That was fast.
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HACKER!!!
MAP HACKER ALERT!!!
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It does look better. I didn't like all the black spotches and added several lights to help... It's suppose to be a night time map so I was trying to keep it kindof on the dark side. Some areas are probably too bright. Obviously not everyone has the same video settings as me. Thanks for tweaking it.
Yea eiii it doesn't take long to compile... about 20-30 minutes I forget exactly.
I'll release the .map file next time... so you don't have to decompile it. ;)
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I didn't have to decompile it to run light. I didn't change the map at all -- just ran with -scale 2. If you compare alpha4 to the older versions, it's considerably darker. This is because rad scales up the texture brightness (q2 textures were twice as dark as they should have been). The pb2 textures are nice and bright, though, so this in effect made it look like everything was unnaturally glowing. Once that was fixed with the new bsp pack, the reflective light was basically cut in half making everything way darker.
Anyway, I think it looks pretty good like this.
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Sorry about that... my knowledge of the optional compile process settings (lack of) shines through. But I think I see what you did.
What needs to be done to release the map as GPL?
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Just include a text file (preferably with the same name as the map file) that states some general info about the map and that it's being released under the terms of the GPL. "See gnu.txt for more information." There should be a copy of gnu.txt in the paintball2 directory that you can include.
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Changing teams while in jail:
I'm sure I saw this talked about somewhere before, but I couldn't find it...
I used build 13 for map testing purposes. In that build (mine anyway) you had to go observer to change teams while in jail. Recently I started using build 15 for testing and it allows you to change teams while in jail. I believe the change was in build 14 but it's easier to ask than to look. :) I don't think this is a big problem. However I was wondering if I could somehow make the jails so you couldn't change teams during the round... such as not being able to change to red while in blue's jail. Is there a setting I could put in worldspawn, or such, just for this map? Does this make sense?
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Jits could hack in something for you in the next build. It might be a cvar, though.
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I don't think it's that big of a deal. I'm just wondering if it's something I could set in worldspawn such as gravity or others can be set. I've found a couple of missaligned/missing brushes so there'll be another release anyway.
In build 13 while in jail you could join observer then join the other team and you would spawn in that teams jail.
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I thought it was kind of silly to have to change to obsever in order to switch teams, so I maded it possible to switch directly, but I didn't take jails into consideration. I think the simplest solution would be to simply respawn a person when he switches teams.
You did remind me of something I was going to mention earlier, though. It might be a good idea for me to add a worldspawn option to disable killing of teammates in jail (if ffire is off). Also, I don't know if you're using it or not, but there's an option to force eliminated players to use the jail (forcejail, I think -- take a look at dodgeball.bsp).
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Well, I'd say it's pretty good. Let's see -- what needed to be fixed? The ladder fort thing on the blue base. You need to edit or create a new batch file to use -scale 2 (-extra and -chop32 will make it look better as well). I'd use "forcejail" "1" in the worldspawn. Do you want me to create a worldspawn option that will prevent teammates from killing each other in jail?
Another thing that kinda bugs me is that some of the crates in the high center area (around the jail buttons) are misaligned. I guess it isn't as obvious where the borders are on those. I might just edit them so that they look the same regardless of alignment.
Oh, yeah, also minor, but the lights over the flag, and I think one light on the high path are one texel off. Not a biggie, but might as well fix it. You might use a different colored light for the blue base, too. Yellow doesn't light blue very well.
I'm going to see if I can modify the green water .wal so it looks like it's emitting more of a green color than brown.
I think that's pretty much it.
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Ok I'm fixing those things we found. I figured out how to edit the bat file. And I think a worldspawn option for no teammate jail kills would be a good option. Most jails you run out of paint and hope to be shot by someone. I'm thinking the respawning when changing teams would be good also, even as worldspawn option or server option... I can see ways to "exploit" the current jails in this map. But again, it's probably not a big deal.
I don't see the problem with the crates in the jail button area, yet. I'll take another look at it. The water looked kindof greenish to me, but I don't see the colors very well.
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I don't see why it would need to be an option. It should just always do it.
I fixed the green water .wal so the light it emits is more green. I also had to fix some other textures, so I'll be releasing a new bsp pack.
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Ok, I'm currently working on a worldspawn option for preventing teammates from killing each other in jail. Just put "nojailffire" "1" in the worldspawn. It will complain about it now, but I should have it up for next week's test.
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Alrighty, give this a whirl...
Routez_alpha6 is ready for testing:
http://rapidshare.de/files/6255943/routez_alpha6.zip.html
routez .map file as promised:
http://rapidshare.de/files/6255979/routez_a6_mapfile.zip.html
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Jits, please localize that.
PLEASE!
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http://dpball.com/files/maps/beta
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Fun stuff. Nothing jumped out at me as needing fixing. We can test the other modes tomorrow, though, just to be sure.
lol, I was laughing so hard after bob shot me right as I escaped from jail, and I spawned back in jail with the door still open and shot him. This is going to be fun to match on.
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GOOD!!!
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I think the map is pretty much done. I'd like to test it again tommorrow if some people are up for it. If you have time Jits? or one of the other servers if Jits doesn't? I'd like someone to look for any problems that can still be fixed before the final release.
I tend to agree, with some people, that some areas of the map are too small/tight, but think overall it's playable and I'll use that learned knowledge for future maps. Other than that I'm looking for texture/brush problems mostly. I always made little changes with every release but now I'd like to finalize the map if it's ready.
So... tomorrow? (Tuesday) 10PM eastern? If I'm late, I'll say I'm sorry right now... been pretty busy lately.
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im there, with or with out u..song from the 80's
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Yup. We'll test that and the new everglades, I think. I might be running a little late myself. We'll see.
Also, it may not be very noticeable, but I still think you should align the crate textures. The light boards are supposed to be on the edge.
Aligned:
(http://dpball.com/images/beta_maps/routez_aligned.jpg)
Misaligned:
(http://dpball.com/images/beta_maps/routez_notaligned.jpg)
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Ok, I think I see now... I see a little white line on the bottom horizontial plank. I'd guess that's the corner. I don't really like how every wooden crate looks exactly the same. I purposely slide and rotated textures to try to make them look different. But I should be able to align them and still rotate them to get the different look I want. Thanks for the screenshots, it helped me to see what you're talking about.
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what about uni new map?
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Why don't you post about that in the thread that was made for it (http://dpball.com/forums/index.php?topic=1196.0)? Please try to keep things on topic, loial.
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NOOO!!!! NOOO!!!! Its was on topic in regards to testing and what will be. Sadly only hobo and bob showed up somewhat on time. which at that time I had to reinstall AAO
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Looks like the only fixes now are lowering the func_getoutofjail so you can't touch it when the doors are halfway closed and the crate texture alignment.
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Unless I've missed something terrible, this will be the final release of routez. I appreciate all the time and help which some people have contributed to this map.
.bsp file: http://rapidshare.de/files/7098514/routez_final.zip.html
.bsp and .map files: http://rapidshare.de/files/7098602/routez_with_map.zip.html
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Hot dog! Time to get this baby in rotation. ;D
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Nice Release! Mappers please take note this is exactly how you should produce your map start through finish. It does take this long(just under 3 months) to iron out all possible bugs and make gameplay favorable.
Great job Krewzer for setting such a good example that hopefully the community can build from, moving forward.
Let's see someone pick up a detailed review on this one now :)
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More MAPS!!
Hobo you did good for a public player that never matches ;)
I was an honor to test it. Jitspoe please add it to the My server , thanks.
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K, it's been added to EV1.
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YES! Make it the only map in rotation!
On another note, why is Dropzone DM in your rotation at all?
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I did not add it.
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I was talking to jits.
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Because it's a fun 'ol classic map?
"AAaaaaaaaghhhhhhh........."
Anyway, map rotations should be discussed on the server forum.
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I was talking to jits.
Really? I had no way of knowing, Sorry.
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Well, since he was the last one to speak, and I didn't prefix my post with "Loial:"...
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Well since you said make it the only map on rotation, and your regarding ev1 servers, i felt compelled to mention that I tried updateing my servers.