Checkmate, we challenge you

[Morphin]

How do they not boast around? They said they'll pay a team to beat them. That's the roosteriest thing you can do. I've done it before a few years back, offered 100$ to any team that could beat us. Why? Because of arrogance. You want to help people improve - help them, but the 50$ bounty is to try to make people try hard to beat you, and shows your arrogance cause they don't expect to have to pay it.

We're simply challenging their arrogance.

I think putting a bounty on yourself for a free game is the most arrogant thing you can do. And does nothing to help the game other than further saying: "we think we're on a complete level above everyone else".  Nobody puts a bounty if they think people might beat them. Source: I've done it before.

First things first.
It seems like you didnt even read the post by prozajik about the bounty.
Here for you Myerz:

Since we won weak 2 tourney as well as the one before that, as I promised we are bringing a form of 'prize' into JMR's tourney.

We are placing a bounty on our heads, whoever can take either 2xBO1s or 1xBO3 ¹ away from us gets the bounty. These BO1s don't have to be in the same tourney, but they have to be in the same ranking 'season' (after JMR resets rankings, we reset your victories against us, but bounty stays the same)

For every consecutive tourney win, we will increase the bounty by 10$. ²

If you manage to succeed in one of the conditions above, we will require demos from all of you from both maps (either two BO1s maps or two maps from BO3) and we give ourselves the right to postpone bounty give away until the demos are reviewed by committee IF we suspect hacking. Based solely on the committee decision you get the money. ³

Victories towards bounty count ONLY in JMR's tourney every sunday.


Current bounty: 10$


So better start training guys and get serious about this tourney, because we definitely are

1 .. Why is it like this? Precaution against BO1 rounds, we can just mess up map pick etc, we allow ourselves to make a one small error.

2 .. We might set a limit for how high the bounty can go, we will see how it all works out first

3 .. It's simple, if you get banned thanks to the demo review you won't get the money. That being said, if committee states that it's clean you get the money no matter what we think.




PS: I came up with the rules for the bounty give away just now, didn't even talk to my mates about details, the rules might change but they are going to be definite in the day of the next tourney (next sunday 8.3.).

Secondly this has nothing to do with arrogance. This bounty is just to encourage other teams to stay active and try to improve.
I dont understand why you are trying to make us look arrogant.
You are the last one who should do that.

[JeongWa]

Nothing interesting since matches between NA and EU teams have been won 99% of the time by the one playing on his own server. (excluding the unknown map). So it will not proove that much to my mind because not even One map will be played fairly. And playing a best of 3 is even more an unfair match for this scenario. Playing cm8t is hard because of their style, and also because they are the masters in the crouch-fights. But thats only possible with low ping. So it's totally different plus i think Playing a match to decide " who is the best " with 180/200 ping is retarded. But i guess this is not a choice.

Also as picky said, instead of doing that, you could just make ur team play for the next tournament in less than 2 weeks and start prooving things if this is what you want And it will be useful in this case because JMR will have one more team. #easierbracket with a pair number of teams

[MyeRs]

Picky - I guess you didn't speak to your team prior to posting,

Shockwave said: "anyone who beats you guys in bo3 or twice in the tournament wins the bounty" -- that's how he told us. And Prozajiik said he'll make a 50$ wager on the match, rather than the bounty.

Also, Temaru: We have no interest in playing a tournament on all EU server. We have nothing to prove, we've beaten everyone significant times. We're just coming due to seeing the bounty.

Lastly - Picky, a bounty is arrogant. No matter how you look at it. Nobody puts a bounty if they don't expect to always win. In one sense, you use it to try to make people try to beat you to give yourselves competition, in another sense you do it cause you know no current active team can beat you. I didn't see a bounty a year ago when you guys weren't on top. Why? Nobody gives money away for free. If you want to help people, how about actually teaching them? Most of the current game has played 2+ years, they wont just improve from your bounty, thats stupid. They'll improve if you go out of your way to teach them.

[prozajik]

There is more than just one angle to look at it. There are teams and decent teams, obviously nobody is on our level otherwise we would have lost the tourney already. While that might be true, these teams are fully capable of beating us if they trained enough.

That being said, people are lazy. Why would anyone put any effort into practicing PB, when there is no motivation? The answer might seem fairly simple now right? Money. That's the reason we placed bounty on our heads. I would be happy to lose to a team which trained hard enough, learned our tactics and countered it, that would actually make the game more interesting. But as I said in the beginning...
People are lazy. The only team I have ever seen practice a lot and train tactics was former sPec. Everyone had equal grounds, yet sPec came the furthest in the smallest amount of time. What was the reason you ask? Motivation.

There is plenty of 'material' available to everyone.

[Squeeze]

omg, typical for this community. a few na players raging against a few eu players. BOOOOOOOOOOM, LETS MAKE A NA VS EU BATTLE OUT OF IT!

Let a 3v3 decide which county is better!
Lets look at LoL and CS:GO to decide who will win!
Lets go full stereotypical!

F*ck this, you are like little kiddies fighting about a snickers. (excluding prozos team, they atlest dont boast around like some other 13-year-minded here)

Hope myers #getsrekt for his #sh'theadbehavior -.-

We were just trashtalking and complaining. Thats normal thing. I love Myers and he loves me. No matter what.

[MyeRs]

Proza - You realize that 50$ isn't an insentive to train, right? Gonass' 250$ tournament didn't make people train. Most teams that have played, have played years. It's not "strategy" that loses games. It's individual skill.

I can't understand how people can say strategy matters in a 1 hit kill game. Sure, there's smarter players and dumber players, but that's playstyle which isn't a teamwide strategy. But just to put it in perspective, me/shk/Clipz beat Power of 5 2-0 all EU server with Clipz going 0-13, and us not even reconing. Yet, in current state of DP they're a "strong" team. But, no offence to them, myself and Shockwave are signficantly better individual players and carried the game 2v3.

Teamwork in DP consists of: When you die you recon (good recon is a big factor but most people can do this if they use voice communication), set up when you have numbers (wow such intense stratgy that nobody can do!!), Revive caps (wow intense strategy, count a revive time, hide and wait for it), and you could argue defending 3v1 - but that is individual intelligence and you don't need communication with anyone to not be stupid.

You could take a team of.... MyeRs / Prozajik / Jeongwa (Just named 3 people who haven't teamed together) - and say: "hey you can't use any communication other than locs" - put them into the tournament on Sundays, and there is a high probability they would win. If they lost, it would be against a team that can rival their individual skill (ie shk/spain/aveiro).

SO TO SUM IT UP: It's 1 hit kill, there's minimal teamwork, it comes down to recon and individual skill. It HELPS if you know "oh hey my teammate is covering ice so if he dies i know they are ice" - but it really doesn't mean that much. The reason teams like Power of 5 were better as sPec, was because they got to match against all sorts of skill levels. Now? They match what... og or cm8t. Rape or get raped.

The reason I don't play is not because of anything in competition, it's because of what Jeongwa wrote above. The competition is cm8t, but in our matches with them, we each win our map on our server - lose the other server, whoever gets tie their server wins. That's not enjoyable. I "used" to be better, or maybe they were worse, and it used to be more decisive in my favor, but now it's server advantage wins match. I would enjoy to play them in a game where we all had even ping to truly see who's better.

[Clipz]

Woah I scored half our points!! But I agree and it was 0-10 . Jmrs team I'll give them credit has gotten better. It even threw me off guard they didn't have someone camping like they did a lot before. The fact all I did was steam for flags and try to cap and didn't need to get a kill shows you the huge distance of skill level there still is. I'm not saying I'm good Anymore just adding to Myers discussion.

[MyeRs]

^ Well the point is teamwork isn't what matters, it's just individual intelligence. If someone who sucks at the game just steams every round, anyone with half a brain would say: "Hey, he's going to steam, I'm going to just wait for his rush, get the free kill, and 3v2 every round" -- But they didn't. That's not teamwork, or anything you need to be vocal about. Strategy means nothing. It's all about individual skill, which part of that is having the game knowledge to know what to do.

Recon + Individual skill = all that is needed in DP2.

[prozajik]

I could go on and on about what are keypoints for good teamwork in PB, but this post isn't about that so I am just going to give you an example since I don't agree with you (and you gave an example yourself).

Let's take the situation you mentioned above. Yes waiting for the 'rusher' is an obvious solution, BUT it only applies when you are thinking about the solution using individual skill, which you obviously are.
There are tons of other ways to approach that situation, if you think in terms of teamplay.
Since you and your team knows (lets have it as a fact), that one guy always rushes speedjump. Well as a team you could decide to use that situation to your advantage, you could decide to rush 2x low with 2nd guy going speed, since there are maximum 2 guys remaining guarding base/main you will have a natural advantage of 2v3.
Another way would be to just let him get flag and wait for him to rush out, the other 2 guys might come from main/base trying to help him get the grab and if you just stay hidden you can get one or two opening kills turning that situation in your favor, or if the other 2 guys won't come you can just simply wait for the flag kill the flag and then go for 2v3 in your base.

Now, you might be able to deal with that if you were really good and clutch the situation, but that's totally different 'issue'.

I would like to point out that IMO teamwork and individual skill are 2 totally different things and should be regarded as such. Yes, if you are good and your opponents are bad no shiet you can win 1v3. That applies for all games tho, look at faker/bjergsen (yeye i just put them in the same sentence, pls burn me). Now take a look at PB, yea we might not always need to use tactics to be able to win, but that only proves what I have written above, but doesn't in any way prove that there is no tactic in PB.
We have to utilize our synergy/game knowledge to be able to beat some of the stronger teams. For example if someone is getting overwhelmed by opposing team players all rushing at him, someone else needs to come and help him with that situation. Or if we are 2v2 and one opponent is grabbing flag we can decide to push for the kill on the other one or just go for flags and try 2v2 scenario, but we need to decide that as a team thus making teamwork a 'thing'.

Well that was longer than I initially planned, well have fun reading that. Also on a more relevant note, I guess for everyone, the match will take place at some other date since spain can't be home on the specified Monday.

[MyeRs]

Prozajiik, if you were to listen to a competitive League of Legends or CS:GO team in a tournament, the communication is insane. Those games rely on communication more than anything. Timing buffs in league is a big thing too.

I've played this game for a long time at a competitive level, and never once have timed a revive. I go: "Uhh, I'm reviving in 10 so be careful he'll revive soon too" -- but nobody consistently calls out revives of themselves and enemy team for the majority of their death. There's slight teamwork, obviously, it's not a pug. But at the end of the day, DP relies more on individual skill.

Would it be different if there were more good teams? Sure. But right now, cm8t can beat JMR's tournaments without voice recon. Why? They are individually 10x better than the rest of the players who participate weekly. DP is 1 hit kill, with fairly simple maps (2-3 paths typically) - and has something most games do not which is recon. Recon eliminates a lot of strategy needed.

If you were to remove recon from DP (ie can only chasecam your team) then DP would rely way more heavily on strategic play. But DP relies on individual skill and recon. If there's 2 even skilled teams, the team with better recon will win. Why has NA historically been better than EU? NA has always used voice recon, and for the longest time EU only used locs. It was a huge advantage that is even bigger than the ping advantage.

Anyways, the reason my team used to be on top for so long, even when going inactive, was due to good recon and individual skill. Cm8t caught up in both those categories, so most matches come down to: who gets tie on their server. Wish there was a fair way to do that, where there's no ping advantage.That would make DP fun, cause we'd have a team that's a real competition. Oh wells.

[Squeeze]

I came here to support teamwork, cuz imo its better... but now i rly want to see DP2 on the similar system like CS:GO is. When u will get killed, u cant chasecam enemy and you can just said where he was when he killed you, or call out where you see enemy. That would be more interesting to see something like this, cuz everybody can see whats your true skill level. I was thinking about that long time, and i kinda want to play matches where chasecam of enemies is turned off. So your plays will depend on your predictions, how you think in game, what you are expecting from enemy [individual skill], and how you can outplay enemy even in 4v4 in 1vs3 situations, cuz u cant get recon and they too. That would be really awesome to see something like this. I want feature, when u rent server, u can choose option to set chasecam of enemies to true/false. [chasecam of teammates always turned on]

[Rockyar_96]

Can you just play instead of throwing arguments at each other. Make it best of 5 and you'll get me watch it all night long :3 Srsly this would be a real event...

[MyeRs]

Can you just play instead of throwing arguments at each other. Make it best of 5 and you'll get me watch it all night long :3 Srsly this would be a real event...

Best of 5 sounds cool.... we should do a 4v4 NA vs EU best of 5. Not "Cm8t vs Myers team" -- That's be more hype. We pick the EU server used, you pick NA server used (so we can atleast get the best ping when on opposition server).

Maps agreed upon beforehand. No spectators.

Myers team captain of NA, and chooses who he thinks the strongest roster is

Prozajiik team captain of EU, and chooses who he thinks the strongest roster is (You can pick any combination of players who are currently living in Europe)

Battle it out in best of 5. 1st 2 maps EU serv, 2nd 2 maps NA server, tie whoever wins by more points on their 2 maps combined.

Just a little fun-hype event for DP. Kind of like All star game in League of Legends. Really there is no gain from winning (ie no prize) - but bragging rights and still one of the most hyped events. There's not much hype things anything. Standard matches? Nobody has records. Tournaments? They are all 1 map games all EU server. This could be a better idea than challenger Checkmate.

Maybe we can still put a 50$ bet on the game, too. Increase the hype. Actually, if it's 4v4, maybe 40$ so each player gets 10.

You get 2 maps your server, so it makes it more reliable to fight for your server (especially with predetermined maps) - so it's less of a fluke of who gets tie map theirs. (Ie team plays pbcup for their map to make sure if they lose it'll only be 10 or less pt diff is not possible).

[luckmore]

prozajik picky rockitude vs myers chemical juicey

ps:  no shk

[MrPeach]

5vs5!

[MyeRs]

@MrPeach - 5v5 is fun, but it's just not played at all and most maps don't really play well for 5s. It's just a clusterintercourse.

@Luckmore - That would be the cm8t vs Myers team match - not sure if it would be the NA vs EU, not sure who the top of each region are.

[DooCi]

I came here to support teamwork, cuz imo its better... but now i rly want to see DP2 on the similar system like CS:GO is. When u will get killed, u cant chasecam enemy and you can just said where he was when he killed you, or call out where you see enemy. That would be more interesting to see something like this, cuz everybody can see whats your true skill level. I was thinking about that long time, and i kinda want to play matches where chasecam of enemies is turned off. So your plays will depend on your predictions, how you think in game, what you are expecting from enemy [individual skill], and how you can outplay enemy even in 4v4 in 1vs3 situations, cuz u cant get recon and they too. That would be really awesome to see something like this. I want feature, when u rent server, u can choose option to set chasecam of enemies to true/false. [chasecam of teammates always turned on]

i agree.there is a command for this that admins  shoud put on servers to make the game more strategic

[DooCi]

the command is "cvar_set chasecamonly". Default is 0, so 1 should only let u chase ur own team. remember to placethis only in matchmode. some matches should be played with this to see how it goes

[Rick]

eh, the reason it works in cs:go is that one team is forced to push the other. CTF, where no one HAS to push, might not work very well.

[Squeeze]

It can actually show, how skilled you are.