Digital Paint Discussion Board
Development => Mapping => Completed Maps => Topic started by: BASEBALLDUDE on March 06, 2013, 06:36:12 PM
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This is not for the mapping contest because (1) I started this before it and (2) it doesn't fit the theme at all.
Neon is a relatively new Paintball2 map. It is rather small, but the abundance of paths allows it to be playable for a small to medium-large crowd. If it's too small, I won't hesitate to make it bigger and add a central area, but if you guys are fine with its size, I'll keep it that way.
There is one flag for each team. That can also be changed if you want.
It does have ice. There is an ice path from the base to your team's outer area. This is not the most effectice path to use, thus the n00bs trying to be "slick" (no pun intended) won't interfere with the serious gamers who are trying to win.
Please note that this map requires the BASEBALLDUDE Texture Pack. You can download it here: https://drive.google.com/file/d/0ByutPv2Z36izelNWWWd6QUhXcVk/edit?usp=sharing
The link above includes the final version of neon.
I posted a ton of (outdated) screenshots so you can get a feel for the map without downloading anything.
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Here's some more.
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That brick path in the second sshot seems unrealistic as it has barely any support, and personally I don't think the texture fits either. For the ground its fine, just not for a bridge like that :P
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Nyancat was here
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does that mean he shat all over his map singing meow meow meow. ;)
Any map is colourful playable i like how you made it so people cant just ice straight to flag. few texture issues here and there but great job baseballdude.
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So should I expand the map to make it larger/ add another flag? Let me know what you think!
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i think you should keep it the size that it is. ( my opinion) dont add another flag it will make the map run faster.( my opinion)
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I think i just puked and then had a seizure at the same time.
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Lol this map is horrendous!
Only good thing is the different styles of boxes.
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I think i just puked and then had a seizure at the same time.
Wait till the final version, I'm going to add a room with rapidly strobing lights.
Chef: Plz add to OTB
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ewwww^
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I'll have a look at the map later. Just noticed a hole you should fix to remove the room behind it.
Map is online @ [OTB] Beta!
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I'll have a look at the map later. Just noticed a hole you should fix to remove the room behind it.
I'm probably going to end up redoing that entire doorway. There are all sorts of edges jutting out if you look closely.
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Use the grid, it helps with that sort of thing.
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Chef: Plz upload textures to OTB Beta. I was playing with someone who claimed that he didn't have the textures.
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Later, I can't upload them atm. For now he could use your zip file.
http://www.melloncollie.de/dp/textures/baseballdude.zip
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OK just upload them as soon as you have the time. The last thing we need is a popular map that's missing half the textures. (I found the missing texture for Italy only recently, same with the cave painting from Discovery. For my first few months I was playing them without all their textures.)
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Plz upload textures to OTB Beta.
Online.
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I am going to start making neon-b2 soon. I will make it larger because right now it's just too small. I will also add another flag, just because every good map these days seems to have two flags.
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I'm not sure if changing this would look better or worse, but I notice the neon lights aren't actually emitting colored light. You'd have to make .wal files in order for the light program to recognize the color.
I will also add another flag, just because every good map these days seems to have two flags.
Ugh. I'd rather see more maps made with good design rather than falling back on the multi-flag crutch. Work on making the flags easier to access and harder to defend.
I will make it larger because right now it's just too small.
I think the size is probably OK, but you need to work on the path balancing. Pretty much everything centers around going across that mid-high path. The other paths are slower and/or more confusing. Work on making the other paths faster and more straightforward, and you should have plenty of play space.
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I'm not sure if changing this would look better or worse, but I notice the neon lights aren't actually emitting colored light. You'd have to make .wal files in order for to recognize the color.
How do you set the color of light that it's emitting? Right now i only know how to control how much light it produces (hit "s", check "light" and put in a value 10-100000) but I would like to know how to control the color.
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The color is controlled by the texture, but the textures need to be in .wal format to work. You'll need wally and the paintball2 palette. Looks like viciouz has a bunch of that stuff packed together here: http://dplogin.com/forums/index.php?topic=10373.0
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I tried and it didnt work. No visible difference.
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Where did you put the .wal files? I think they need to be in the quake2/pball/textures directory somewhere in the BSP subdirectory... wherever the other ones are. I guess you'd have to have the .wal files for them to show up in BSP so you could use them at all, though, right? Have you tried lighting something with colored lights using the existing textures to make sure that works?
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crayola just had an orgy.
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Where did you put the .wal files? I think they need to be in the quake2/pball/textures directory somewhere in the BSP subdirectory... wherever the other ones are. I guess you'd have to have the .wal files for them to show up in BSP so you could use them at all, though, right? Have you tried lighting something with colored lights using the existing textures to make sure that works?
I know how to make colored light using entities but not brush surface properties. And yes I've been using the .wal files for a long time. It might just be the technique I'm using for creating the light. Right now I am checking the "light" box and typing "2000" in the value box.
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Do you not get any errors in the lighting stage about not finding textures? Odd. I wonder why the lighting isn't coloured
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"WARNING: Colormap not found- no colored texture lighting"
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Go to your paintball folder, go to pball, go to pics, copy colormap.pcx (don't just move it) and paste it in C:\bsp\pball2
Edit: oh and in C:\bsp\pball2\quake2\pball\pics as well
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Thanks it works now
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Neon_b2 will be out within one or two weeks. Here's a preview.
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Neon Beta 2 is out! I have massively reconstructed it so the gameplay and aesthetics are a lot better.
-More Paths
-Paths Are Less Confusing
-Larger Map Size
-Central Area Added
-Second Flag Added, Worth Three Points
-"Superstairs" Technique Used For First Flag
-More Aquatic Features
-Neon Fountain Landmarks The Center Of The Map
-Now Suitable For A Larger Crowd
-Colored Lighting From The Neon Lights
-Bridge Has More Support
-Bridge Is No Longer The Best Route- There Is No Longer A Clear "Best Route"
-Nyan Cat Left The Main Map
-Nyan Cat Invades The Secret Room
-Secret Room (accessible via no clip observer mode) Has NEON STROBE LIGHTS
Requires the latest BASEBALLDUDE Texture Pack- WARNING: Some of the textures have been changed as of today, so if the "credits" textures are still not square-shaped, you need to get the latest version here: http://www.filedropper.com/baseballdudetexturepackupdated
Please give me as much feedback as possible. The next version could possibly be the final version.
Edit: The .bsp file was too large so it's also included in the BASEBALLDUDE Texture Pack.
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More pictures. Also, I forgot to mention:
-Fixed message in worldspawn entity
-Fixed base so you have to get to the top for it to count
Feedback is appreciated!
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Please give me as much feedback as possible. The next version could possibly be the final version.
Feedback is appreciated!
WHERE'S MY FEEDBACK?! :P
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Here is some.. this map hurts my eyes and gives me major headachs.
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Thanks, Clipz. Anyone else gonna give me feedback?
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I can't say much on the technicalities of the map, as I am still on clipz' level when it comes to mapping; however, the map is very "hip" and/or "swag-ed the fuark out". Your mapping originality brings a tingling sensation to my scrotum.
You should most certainly continue to express your creativity with BSP, and bring this game some much-needed innovativeness.
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Reminds me of a UT3 map
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lol@clipz/termi comments.
When have either of you made a map that was good haha. Don't comment. At least this one has originality, and much less misaligned garbage tossed together than what you both have put out.
Keep up the creativity. It's an interesting concept, based on the screenshots. Could be cool. You could be the next cusoman sir.
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Here is my feedback in demo form, I hope it is good feedback you can use. :)
This isn't criticism.
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Thanks omni. Just to let you know there are a few autocockers in the water, more accessible for the noobs.
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You should make a Nyan cat model running around the map singing.
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Myers, wtf is your god darn problem. At least I made maps that got played. The day you make maps or do something positive to the community besides troll everyone for everything. I gave my honest opinion the neon lights are ugly and hurt my head.
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Clipz whatever you do, don't go to Vegas. lol
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I'm not sure how this is going to turn out! Good luck!
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Who thinks I should use this
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LOLCAT
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Chef or T3 Please upload b2 to OTB Beta
And if anyone would be so kind as to upload this file to their ftp site I would really appreciate it. (Cause with these sites the link becomes dead within a few days.) http://www.filedropper.com/baseballdudetexturepackupdated
Or if that link doesn't work anymore try this: https://docs.google.com/file/d/0ByutPv2Z36izbkFXdUdmaE1NQlk/edit
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It's online.
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Thanks.
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Had to. Credit goes to Nub and Skitzo!
(Hope some people remember shockoi, good times).
How could you forget shockoi?
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I think this can be good if tastefully done, but right now the colors are just too overpowering. Instead of having things like solid blue platforms, I would use a neutral texture and have small blue outlines or some other sort of highlight.
- Way too many water planes. The game only renders reflections on 2 surfaces by default, and that should be avoided if possible. You have way more than that. You should keep all water on one plane. Things like the waterfall, you could do with the waterfall texture and remove the "warp" flag.
- Are the purple barrels supposed to have blue tops?
- It's possible to get stuck behind those barrels.
- Lighting is way too bright and uniform. Try to think about your light sources and get some good variation. Lighting makes or breaks a map.
- The ladders are ridiculously huge. 4m (13ft) wide... Also, being solid colors looks bad. If you made them a darker metal color and had just little strips of color in them, I think it would look a lot better.
- The water path to the flag is slow/not fun. I would remove the water paths completely, personally (also helps with the reflection issue).
- Lots of the jumps are blocked by things, like the ramp to high gets blocked by the "neon" text.
- Ice path into the base just ends abruptly, and it's not obvious you're supposed to turn right.
- A lot of the paths in general just feel kind of haphazard, lacking intuitive direction and flow. It's very easy to get lost.
Here are some inspirational images:
http://pcdn.500px.net/10196695/2ad8658afe3b1f6de4c1ddf49aba35ec637d4dc0/4.jpg
http://cdn.decoist.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/10/A-glowing-modern-handrail.jpg
http://i3.squidoocdn.com/resize/squidoo_images/250/draft_lens18939756module155444320photo_1322407645StairsPersonWalking.jpg
http://i00.i.aliimg.com/img/pb/816/336/255/1277807906925_hz-myalibaba-temp11_1470.jpg
http://i.ebayimg.com/t/RGB-LED-WALKWAY-HALLWAY-STAIRWAY-RUNWAY-STAIRS-PATIO-DECK-YARD-STEPS-LIGHTS-KIT-/00/s/MzI1WDI3MA==/$(KGrHqRHJ!wE9qVSwOdTBPflllE7L!~~60_35.JPG
http://idighardware.com/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2011/05/Luminous-Egress-Path-Markings-BALCO.jpg
http://www.activesafety.com/images/products-stairs2.jpg
http://www.usreflector.com/images/Glow-in-dark/day-night-images/station-stairs-1C.jpg
http://lumagrip.files.wordpress.com/2010/08/boujis-stairs-1.jpg
http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3257/3125426367_1452fd187f_z.jpg
http://media.tumblr.com/zZ7ytU2a8ha4aaqun7QQNCj9o1_500.jpg
http://thumbs.dreamstime.com/thumblarge_68/1151353001VhtmPM.jpg
http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8505/8406438610_827cf633a1_z.jpg
http://i607.photobucket.com/albums/tt158/10crazymonkay01/gm_rave_club0003.jpg
http://www.interactivearchitecture.org/wp-content/imagebank/dedge.jpg
http://bedzine.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2010/03/Tron-deck-lighting-thumb-550x403-36215.jpg
http://o.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/12/disney-tron-legacy-inspired-legacy-of-the-river-suite-at-the-ice-hotel-arctic-sweden_660.jpg
http://levelupnews.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/12/TRON_PS_Home_0001.jpg
http://3dguy.tv/wp-content/uploads/2010/05/tron-legacy-2.jpg
I've attached a demo of playing around on the beta server so you can get a feel for how some of the gameplay pans out.
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Here's an example of what I'm talking about on the ladder:
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To many random paths. The map itself doesn't even seem to be finished, so how is this beta? This is still in progress. Flag 2 placement makes no sense at the moment.
A bunch of jumps take you nowhere.
I still think the idea of the map is kinda cool. But the execution did not go well. You tried to put too much, and it just doesn't make sense. There's so much different things going on, and it looks like you just forced paths everywhere without actually thinking about how it would play out. But, that's why gameplay is the hardest thing to do.
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Thanks for the feedback, jitspoe. And myers, the abundance of paths is for attack strategy. These days, there are too many maps that are too similar. Shazam33, Reminissions, Propaint, and Razzle all kind of run together.
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Thanks for the feedback, jitspoe. And myers, the abundance of paths is for attack strategy. These days, there are too many maps that are too similar. Shazam33, Reminissions, Propaint, and Razzle all kind of run together.
Numerous paths can work, but these just have far to many different paths of different speeds, making it unbalanced. Also, multiple paths is good - but how do you expect team to recon this? You have to keep that stuff in mind. Not every team has voice communication. There's TOO many useless paths that add nothing to the gameplay. In pubs, these added paths make people get lost who are new to the game. In matches, this map just wouldn't get played in its current state.
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Thanks for the demo Jitspoe. In beta 3, I plan to:
-make the map simpler and flow better
-make a more obvious ladder in that water area
-remove some of the water
-make the breathing area under the ladder like the one in the mid
-put the arrow textures where necessary
-improve the ladders and other stuff to look better
-make the neon text embedded into the wall so it doesn't block jump
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-make the neon text embedded into the wall so it doesn't block jump
i recommend a mist-corpse brush for this :)
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What does corpse do?
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If you check the "mist" option in the surface properties, it will make it so the brush isn't solid (you can just go right through it). Embedding the text may look better, though, and use fewer polygons if done well.
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If you check the "mist" option in the surface properties, it will make it so the brush isn't solid (you can just go right through it). Embedding the text may look better, though, and use fewer polygons if done well.
Mist sounds simple enough, but what does corpse do? Also, what do the current_180, current_up, etc. flags do? (just curious)
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I think he was using a different term for the same thing, though I don't know that I've seen it called that in any Q2 map editor. The current flags are for water so you can push the player in different directions.
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corpse will make your brush "shootable" even if it is mist or anything else.(works in combinition with clip also - in some cases you can replace a nodraw brush with that combo)
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OK
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NEON Beta 3 is finally here! I have fixed most of the problems; however it is still incredibly laggy due to high r_speeds. If someone can give me a hint as to where I should put hint brushes in order to optimize performance, I would greatly appreciate it. Download it here: https://docs.google.com/file/d/0ByutPv2Z36izYUlwNTUtMHRBQTQ/edit
FIXED:
-better lighting
-better-looking bridge
-better-looking ladders (thanks jitspoe)
-better-looking flag platform
-faster water path- 16 unit high water allows for land speed
-translucent colored covers like the one in the mid are now present throughout the map
-water planes fixed
-easier to get to 2nd flag
-fixed respawn entities to minimize spawnkilling
-fixed message in worldspawn for the new loading screen in build 38
-blue barrel tops on pink barrels fixed
-various texture adjustments
-neon arrows and flags help people to not get lost while providing more aesthetics
-ice ramp now leads to a little thing that sort of shoots you into the mid
-ice added on the formerly useless tunnel to make it faster and more fun
-crates removed because they were blocking a jump
-enlarged jump between each base and the mid
-neon text now embedded into the wall so as not to block the jump
-various other gameplay tweaks
NOT FIXED:
-the map is still incredibly laggy due to high r_speeds. If someone can give me a hint as to where I should put hint brushes, it would be really helpful because I have tried and failed with hint brushes.
-there is a certain misalignment on the opposite wall of the flags. Just ignore it for now, I will fix it up in the next version.
-the lighting in the water tunnels might be too colored- tell me if it is and I will or will not fix it.
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More Pictures
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So is anyone gonna give me feedback?
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Looks nice, although the almost pitch black walls can make the base hard to navigate. The problem with the r_speeds is more of a design issue: you can stand in front of your team's coloured splat sign in the base, and look all the way through the mid to the other side, opening up the whole of the main path, which is a good 5k wpoly due to the detailing, and then the reflective water also being in VIS doubles that. There aren't really many places a hint brush would help.
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So who else is going to give me feedback?
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If you want to do the final release of this map, I'll try to have a look at it soon.
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If you want to do the final release of this map, I'll try to have a look at it soon.
I'm probably going to do one more beta before final.
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NEON Beta 5 is here! I have fixed the lag for the most part by removing the reflective water. Tell me if the water at the fountain looks kind of weird and I might change that. Here are a few things that I have fixed:
-Removed some objects that could block a speeding player if they go to the far right tunnel from the mid
-Removed all reflective surfaces
-Replaced flowing reflective water metal texture with solid tile texture
-Fixed the back of banner problem that I stated earlier
-better strobe lights at the end of the game
-quick fix to remove the ladder problem from neon_b4
Things that have not been fixed:
-Still need to close that dead end tunnel near flag 2
-Tell me if anything else needs to be fixed, because the next release will probably be final.
Download it here: https://docs.google.com/file/d/0ByutPv2Z36izcGhHaVNNdDlDVzA/edit?usp=sharing
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I have uploaded neon_b5 to fix the ladders not working in beta 4. Please give me feedback, because the next version will be final. Also Chef, T3, or jits, plz upload to beta server.
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Here's some feedback.
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(https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/32004747/Leisure/Images/paintball2/neon_b5/sshot0003.jpg)
(https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/32004747/Leisure/Images/paintball2/neon_b5/sshot0004.jpg)
It's dark. Very dark. In the two above screenshots, you can barely see where the two walls meet. The first time I ran through there, I couldn't even see if there was a floor and ended up falling through.
(https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/32004747/Leisure/Images/paintball2/neon_b5/sshot0005.jpg)
It's not much brighter here. I suggest changing the texture of this platform's floor to make it easier for players to see.
(https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/32004747/Leisure/Images/paintball2/neon_b5/sshot0006.jpg)
(https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/32004747/Leisure/Images/paintball2/neon_b5/sshot0008.jpg)
(https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/32004747/Leisure/Images/paintball2/neon_b5/sshot0009.jpg)
(https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/32004747/Leisure/Images/paintball2/neon_b5/sshot0010.jpg)
The textures above need rotating. I may have missed some spots as well, so you should do a detailed run through and make sure you didn't miss any.
(https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/32004747/Leisure/Images/paintball2/neon_b5/neoncheck1.jpg)
The flow direction of the water in the fountain is awkward to say the least. The red arrows show what you have. While it still wouldn't be realistic, changing the corners so that the water flows in the direction of the yellow arrows might make it look better.
(https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/32004747/Leisure/Images/paintball2/neon_b5/sshot0012.jpg)
(https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/32004747/Leisure/Images/paintball2/neon_b5/sshot0013.jpg)
Again, it's dark. The red base is already not very bright, but the overall hue of the blue base makes it even worse. Also, that's an odd texture choice for the base under the flag, though it's not a problem.
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Thanks for the feedback!
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It's looking much nicer! Well done on this map, sir. You've improved a lot!
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Here are a few questions I would like answered before final release:
-Is it really too dark, or is that just one guy's opinion?
-Does it have too many paths? If so, which one should I remove?
-How can I fix the water at the base of the fountain to look less ugly?
-Are there any other changes you would like to see made?
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It's not just his opinion. Most of the map is too dark. I know it helps with the look of the map, but it makes finding paths really difficult, strains the eyes, and gives people with brighter monitors a huge advantage. Most of the map should be a good 2x brighter (except for the middle area). I'll try to give some more feedback later.
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I have brightness all the way up. To stop those dark areas from being completely black.
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OK I will make it brighter. The final release may be tomorrow, so this might be your last chance to give me constructive feedback.
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I'll post feedback these days. Please make an other Beta with the new lighting first. It's a big change you shouldn't do for a final release without a step between.
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OK then, neon beta 6 will come later this morning.
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Looks nice so far. Some very cool texture combinations.
Unfortunately the r_speeds go up to 7000 in some parts of the map. I hope you can fix this a little bit, maybe with some hint bruhes or make sure that no face of the water reflect.
For the lighting I'll wait for the next beta. It's really hard to navigate at the moment.
You could add "gamemode""4" and "maxteams" "2" to the worldspawn.
To fix the bad field warning while loading the map you need to delete the value key on the low count flags.
And a few screenshots...
(http://www.otb-server.de/wbblite/attachments/3904.jpg) (http://www.otb-server.de/wbblite/attachments/3903.jpg)
Red: There are vis errors on different ladders. Maybe detailing them or moving them a few units might help.
Green: Rotate this textures.
(http://www.otb-server.de/wbblite/attachments/3906.jpg) (http://www.otb-server.de/wbblite/attachments/3905.jpg)
Red: I'd avoid this hole and make the top brush bigger.
(http://www.otb-server.de/wbblite/attachments/3909.jpg) (http://www.otb-server.de/wbblite/attachments/3908.jpg)
Red: One more ladder. Looks like you forgot a small brush here. Or another vis error?
(http://www.otb-server.de/wbblite/attachments/3911.jpg) (http://www.otb-server.de/wbblite/attachments/3910.jpg)
Red: vis error, try to move the arrow a little bit to fix this.
(http://www.otb-server.de/wbblite/attachments/3913.jpg) (http://www.otb-server.de/wbblite/attachments/3912.jpg)
Red: Wrong textures.
(http://www.otb-server.de/wbblite/attachments/3915.jpg) (http://www.otb-server.de/wbblite/attachments/3914.jpg)
Red: Also some missing brushes or vis error?
(http://www.otb-server.de/wbblite/attachments/3917.jpg) (http://www.otb-server.de/wbblite/attachments/3916.jpg)
Red: I'd use the same textures here. Also the other base looks different.
(http://www.otb-server.de/wbblite/attachments/3919.jpg) (http://www.otb-server.de/wbblite/attachments/3918.jpg)
Red: Maybe rotate the texture for these barrels.
(http://www.otb-server.de/wbblite/attachments/3921.jpg) (http://www.otb-server.de/wbblite/attachments/3920.jpg)
Red: Looks a little bit weird. I'd make this brush bigger to avoid the hole on the right side.
(http://www.otb-server.de/wbblite/attachments/3923.jpg) (http://www.otb-server.de/wbblite/attachments/3922.jpg)
Green: Same texture rotation for this barrel.
Red: Misaligned.
(http://www.otb-server.de/wbblite/attachments/3925.jpg) (http://www.otb-server.de/wbblite/attachments/3924.jpg)
Red: I'd try to avoid splitting this texture, looks not very well. Make it a little bit smaller or bigger.
Green: Try to align these faces, bright<>bright and dark<>dark.
(http://www.otb-server.de/wbblite/attachments/3927.jpg) (http://www.otb-server.de/wbblite/attachments/3926.jpg)
Red: Same here. Try to align these wood textures. Moving it a little bit would look more realistic.
(http://www.otb-server.de/wbblite/attachments/3929.jpg) (http://www.otb-server.de/wbblite/attachments/3928.jpg)
Red: I'd rotate these faces.
(http://www.otb-server.de/wbblite/attachments/3931.jpg) (http://www.otb-server.de/wbblite/attachments/3930.jpg)
Red: Move it up like you did on the blue side. Or just make it same :)
(http://www.otb-server.de/wbblite/attachments/3933.jpg) (http://www.otb-server.de/wbblite/attachments/3932.jpg)
Red: Wrong texture!?
(http://www.otb-server.de/wbblite/attachments/3935.jpg) (http://www.otb-server.de/wbblite/attachments/3934.jpg)
Red: Maybe it would look better to use to color texture for this small face, too. You did that for the left floor on the pic already.
Beta 5 is online @ [OTB] Beta!
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Download neon_b6.zip here: https://docs.google.com/file/d/0ByutPv2Z36izR0FSOXRhZFlsR0U/edit?usp=sharing
NEON Beta 6 is here! I have fixed the lighting to make it brighter (but not close to as bright as beta 2) and I've made various other tweaks, such as removing the useless tunnel.
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A few quick things - I've been meaning to put together a demo with more specifics:
Lighting: Still a bit too dark in many areas. I have a bit of glare on my monitor right now, and I really have to strain to see things in some areas. Try this -- go into your video options, gamma/brightness settings, enable hardware gamma, then crank the gamma slider all the way to the left. That will give you an idea of what some people see your map like. You should be able to navigate easily and see other players like that. If not, your map is too dark. Some areas have random bright light with no source... looks weird (ex: center of map). I don't like the light above "NEON". It gets in the way and defeats the purpose of having the letters illuminated anyway...
R_Speeds: Way too high. I think you need to redo the center are of the map to block visibility.
Flow: A lot of the paths feel very awkward to get to and navigate.
Base: Stairs next to flag are very framerate dependent. Try walking up them with cl_maxfps 10 and you'll see what I mean.
Lots of little texture alignment issues and such like Chef-Killer pointed out.
Until you revamp the map to reduce the r_speeds and get some solid play testing done on it, I don't think it's close to being final yet. It is looking a lot better, though.
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This is the final release of NEON! You can download the final version here: https://docs.google.com/file/d/0ByutPv2Z36izZWNkai0wZW5Dcm8/edit?usp=sharing
So, this is it folks! The best final map that has been released this week! I highly encourage you to try it out, see how you like it, and add it to your server to see what other people think of it.
EDIT: Not final lol
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:/ a simple bsp would do. too lazy to unzip that
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Nice Baseballdude, I like it!
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(This is from my laptop)
Need to be fixed IMO:
-All the water, it kills my fps. (300+ down to low 40's).
-rspeeds are very high in some areas.
-Some barrels and other textures misaligned (as previously stated by someone else)
Otherwise, map seems like it's coming a long nicely. I don't think it's quite ready for a final release, but it's very close!
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I agree with jitspoe and Rick, it doesn't play well at the moment and need some more improvements. Also there's no chance to test anything if you do a final release 10 hours (sleeping and working :P) after the last beta.
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I played this map on a large pub (about 25 players, most of them n00bs but a few good players) and gameplay actually went very well, I received many compliments, and I didn't even win by that much. So yeah, this is final.
EDIT: no it's not lol
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Why does the words NEON (in the middle of the map) have different colors?
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Why does the words NEON (in the middle of the map) have different colors?
Because neon discharges every colour.... duh.
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Honestly better then most newbies mapping today but its just to ugly for me to look at
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Honestly better then most newbies mapping today but its just to ugly for me to look at
That's not very constructive. :\ What parts do you find ugly?
Before you consider this final, you really need to, at the bare minimum, fix the r_speeds issue. Performance is going to be a problem. And with a lot of players likely to be visible at once, since there's not a lot of visibility blocking, it's going to be even worse.
I've attached a demo with some more thorough feedback. Forgot to point out some of the ladder texture issues, but I think Chef-Killer already pointed those out. Also, the light in the middle with no source looks bad.
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I mean the Bright colors its just not appealing at all to me. Hurts my eyes and head.
From the SS's it looks like he did a decent job mapping. Im not saying the maps a fail, im just saying the neon lights suck for me. This is his first map he has completed right? He did a good job constructing it from the SS's.
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When I play Paintball 2 I normally get 1,000 FPS but when I play this map sometimes I get less than 300 FPS.
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Thanks for the feedback everyone! I actually played this map on someone else's computer and realized that it's too dark. So I will make another final where everything that you mentioned will be fixed. Maybe not some of the opinion stuff, but definitely the technical errors.
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Thanks for the feedback everyone! I actually played this map on someone else's computer and realized that it's too dark. So I will make another final where everything that you mentioned will be fixed. Maybe not some of the opinion stuff, but definitely the technical errors.
So you'll be fixing the r_speeds, good. :)
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So you'll be fixing the r_speeds, good. :)
That is one of the things I will do, problem is I'm not sure what I should do to fix r_speeds without changing gameplay too much. Any ideas anyone?
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Hint brushes. But... I dont know how to do them cusoman might tell you.
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Hint brushes may not help because the map is so open its more a design flaw (no offence baseballdude) you can see from one end of the map to the other by adding in hint brushes you would only increase the amount of lag because more brushes are being rendered.
That is one of the things I will do, problem is I'm not sure what I should do to fix r_speeds without changing gameplay too much. Any ideas anyone?
Without changing game-play to much,
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Did you try turning your gamma down like I suggested? I think an important thing is getting light on the ground. That helps with seeing the paths, and lighting the other players (entity brightness is determined by the ground below them). You might try doing strips of white light along the ground so you can keep the overall dark visuals, but have enough light in the appropriate locations to see well.
As for the r_speeds, I wouldn't be too worried about changing the gameplay. Granted, I haven't actually play tested it, but I don't think it would play that well as-is. I think you could actually make it play better by blocking off those long sight lines.
Did you watch my demo?
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I watched the demo, and I appreciate all the feedback. However, I tested this map with brighter lighting on several different occasions and gameplay went well pretty much every single time.
That idea about putting smaller white lights on the ground is actually a really good idea. I think I will try that just to see how it goes.
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Neon Beta 8 is here! I have changed the gameplay and added vis blockers to get rid of the high r_speeds (it only took 6 seconds to vis!). I have removed paths that I thought were unnecessary. I have added lights at the bottom in some areas, please give me feedback on that and the rest of the map. Download it below:
https://docs.google.com/file/d/0ByutPv2Z36izUngyaWxhbkJTUE0/edit?usp=sharing
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Looks so much better than it did, haven't had time to play it so I can't comment on that, I'll see if we can get |210| to match on it and see how it plays out. Good Job
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More feedback please. Thanks omni, but I would like opinions from multiple people so I can get a better understanding of what I need to do in the next beta or final version if everyone likes it.
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Sorry for the rushed new beta but I found some bugs on beta 8 so I made beta 9, which is mostly just a bug fix from beta 8.
Please give me feedback because it is I value your opinion and you have the potential to influence my next beta release of this map, or final if you think everything is fine and dandy.
Download it here: https://docs.google.com/file/d/0ByutPv2Z36izeWdfOWlKay1sTG8/edit?usp=sharing
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Looks much much better with the increased brightness.
Most of the things that need fixing are just misaligned textures.
(https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/32004747/Leisure/Images/paintball2/neon_b9/sshot0000.jpg)
(https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/32004747/Leisure/Images/paintball2/neon_b9/sshot0001.jpg)
Top barrels' textures need fixing.
(https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/32004747/Leisure/Images/paintball2/neon_b9/sshot0004.jpg)
Probably should rotate the slope's texture.
(https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/32004747/Leisure/Images/paintball2/neon_b9/sshot0007.jpg)
(https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/32004747/Leisure/Images/paintball2/neon_b9/sshot0008.jpg)
Alas! The pain of having perfectly aligned textures on a tilted box. Nice try.
(https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/32004747/Leisure/Images/paintball2/neon_b9/sshot0010.jpg)
Derp.
I didn't check both bases for the above misaligned textures, so you should double check them.
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Suggestions:
(https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/32004747/Leisure/Images/paintball2/neon_b9/sshot0009.jpg)
You definitely should add a clip brush here, as players can get stuck quite easily on the slanted support column and/or the wall corner if they're going at top speed.
(https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/32004747/Leisure/Images/paintball2/neon_b9/sshot0005.jpg)
This corner looks kind of awkward, as nothing's actually attached to each other or to the floor.
(https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/32004747/Leisure/Images/paintball2/neon_b9/sshot0011.jpg)
I'm not sure if you intended this, but players can hop onto the glowing strip and walk across to the bridge on the right side of the screen.
Overall in terms of aesthetics, nice job. The flowing water in the fountain also looks much more natural. I have no idea how the gameplay is though.
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Thanks musickid999! Anyone else gonna give me feedback please?
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Sorry for double posting. I'm gonna be gone for two weeks so when I come back I'm going to use all feedback posted to make a final release of neon.
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Have a look at the barrels and boxes, there are some more texture misalignments. There is also one side of a glass box, that looks like there is no colored glass.
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I think your neon logo (and a lot of other areas in the map) could look better if they were thinner with a white core and a colored outer area, like the image I have attached. I would also consider moving the logo or light so you don't have the light directly on top of something that's supposed to be glowing -- kind of kills the effect.
Don't have time to look at it in depth right now, but I've uploaded beta 9 to the beta server.
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Thanks for your feedback, I think the final release is in sight!
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So is texture misalignments on barrels and crates the only thing I need to do before releasing the final? Please tell me what you think.
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Fix all the things, release a new beta and if noone can find a new bug: rename the last beta to final.
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Neon Beta 10 is now here! It's been a while because I have been focusing mostly on New York, but I finally got around to fixing the textures and such. Make sure to tell me if there's anything you want to see changed; if not, the next release could be final.
Download: https://docs.google.com/file/d/0ByutPv2Z36izNXJ1RHJGbzkwZnM/edit?usp=sharing
Note: The download link also includes New York beta 2. Feel free to give me feedback on both maps to ensure that your voice gets heard.
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I'm not sure what all you changed, but I found it way more difficult to see people in this version. You might want to make the light next to the ground white instead of colored, and maybe a bit brighter. It's impossible to tell team colors with such strong colored lighting. This map almost needs some kind of custom setting to make the players have neon glowy bits, too, then maybe it wouldn't be a problem. :)
I'd also suggest altering your custom purple neon color to be closer to that of the default textures. It looks a bit off now...
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Oh I know what the problem was, I switched my wal textures so that I could work on New York and I forgot to switch them back.
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Neon Beta 11 is here! This update makes gameplay and aesthetics a little better.
Beta 11:
-Modified the 2nd flag area so it's more accessible and there are no dead ends
-Made the ice more colorful (you'll see what I mean if you play this map)
-Slightly brighter neon blue lights, IMO looks much better than before
-Slightly brighter lighting overall
-Removed brush-created grate that might have been adding to the r_speeds and replaced it with a chainllink fence. It's behind the waterfall.
-Moved a rampway that nobody ever uses to the side so it's not blocking the pathway
-Made strobe lights at end of game less buggy and not entity dependent
A few things:
-You need the latest version of the BASEBALLDUDE texture pack because of the updated neonblue texture and the new strobe texture. It should come with the download link, so just unzip it to the Paintball2 directory and choose to copy and replace the hr4/neonblue.jpg file. Or you could do it manually, whatever your preference is. There is no HR4 texture for "strobe.png" because it wouldn't make any difference.
-You might also notice that the style I used for coloring the ice is different for each team's side. This is because after experimentation, I found that the purple style looks horrible when blue and vice versa.
Neon Beta 11: https://docs.google.com/file/d/0ByutPv2Z36izWDk5Nk5RTzFqX0k/edit?usp=sharing
Please upload to the beta server and make sure to give me feedback!
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Uploaded to the beta server. I still think the map is too dark. Make sure you're testing it with the stock brightness settings (temporarily rename your config.cfg if you're unsure). This area in particular, I find to be a bit straining (1st shot). On a side note, the textures on that angled bit look misaligned (in the area behind the shot as well).
2nd shot is just about completely black.
3rd shot looks like a messed up brush. Also, the texture on some of those ladders needs to be rotated 90 degrees (though it's kind of minor - I doubt most people would look close enough to see).
In all honesty, I'd just compile the whole thing with -scale 2 on the lighting, then make the lighting in the middle darker.
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What does -scale 2 do, and where do you enter it?
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So looking at these screenshots at work, I came to the realization that the near-black areas could be seen just fine on this crappy, uncalibrated monitor.
I'll have to check when I get home to see if my monitor is properly calibrated, but I feel it's probably closer than this one. I've adjusted the screenshots to look like what they looked like on my monitor on this one.
In the first screenshot, it's almost impossible to tell where the metal ends and the sky starts.
In the second screenshot, the metal wall looked almost completely black, and you couldn't easily tell where the wall ended and the floor and ceiling started.
You should attempt to calibrate your monitor and/or game to match sRGB as closely as possible. That's what Paintball2 is designed for. Also keep in mind that some people will have monitors that are darker than sRGB, so you might want to try cranking down your gamma and playing the map.
As for the -scale parameter, that goes in the lighting process. The easiest way to do this would be to find the .bat file you're using to compile (probably one of the final compile ones), make a copy of it, then on the rad line, (where it has -extra -chop, etc.), add -scale 2. Then compile your map using the copy batch file.
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Yeah your screenshots look a lot different than my computer.
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In this post (http://dplogin.com/forums/index.php?topic=25733.msg238482#msg238482) (the one at the top of page 7), how difficult is it for you to see the difference between the wall and the ceiling on the left side?
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In this post (http://dplogin.com/forums/index.php?topic=25733.msg238482#msg238482) (the one at the top of page 7), how difficult is it for you to see the difference between the wall and the ceiling on the left side?
It's not too difficult.
Jitspoe: You need to update your baseballdude/hr4/neonblue.jpg to the current file. The entire blue side looks so much better.
Edit: The neonblue file is bad so I will give a new download link.
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Just out of curiosity, what are these textures supposed to emulate? They seem awfully large for the amount of detail they have, and what are the bumps supposed to be? When they emit light and are fully bright, you can't really see any of the detail, anyway, so why not just have a solid-color 8x8 texture. It'll use a lot less memory.
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They are not bumps; merely, they are slight changes in color so that the texture is overall less boring. If you're talking about the small circular rivets, those are supposed to represent tiny bubbles of air in the neon tube.
As for the large and hr4 tendencies of the neon textures, that just because if you have anything more detailed than solid, monochromatic textures, HD is always better:)
And why not save memory by using 8 by 8 solid colors? Because I thought I just heard you say that texture memory doesn't make a huge difference in terms of lagginess.
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It depends on your video card. On my laptop with a crapy integrated video card, the highres textures cause it to lag terribly, because it doesn't have enough memory. I was referring more to the file sizes and just the fact that you can't really see those details when the surface is lit. It just looks solid blue with a few weird marks.
Also, I think the purple texture needed more adjusting than the blue one, as it is a different color from the default team color textures.
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It depends on your video card. On my laptop with a crapy integrated video card, the highres textures cause it to lag terribly, because it doesn't have enough memory. I was referring more to the file sizes and just the fact that you can't really see those details when the surface is lit. It just looks solid blue with a few weird marks.
Also, I think the purple texture needed more adjusting than the blue one, as it is a different color from the default team color textures.
It's weird like that, the rest of the purple textures tend to be much closer to blue than to red. I don't think the texture itself needs to be changed; as long as the wal file has the correct hue, it will show up correctly in-game.
I've been busy lately but I'll try to get beta 12 up soon with the scale 2 set, the neon purple fixed, the chainlink problem fixed, and the neonmag wal texture fixed.
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Neon Beta 12 is now here!
There have been a few minor changes. The map is now brighter overall, there is a chainlink fence behind the waterfall, a bug was fixed, and the barrel textures are all aligned.
I also changed the message: "The NEON Maze (c)2013 BASEBALLDUDE". I think the "maze" idea will help newbies to understand that it is indeed pretty challenging to navigate. Plus, I think "A relatively new PB2 map" is pretty boring. Let me know what you think!
As of now there are zero problems that I know need to be fixed, so if the only feedback I receive is positive, this is going final!
This is part of my combo release that also includes new york, beta 3. Feel fee to give me feedback on both maps, I'd really appreciate it!
Also, everyone needs to download two "fixed" textures and the recent "strobe" texture. This is especially important if you're planning on putting Neon on your server because remember what I said, servers with bad textures are bulls hit.
Here is the download link. Make sure you "copy and replace" hr4/metal_02.jpg and hr4/neonblue.jpg.
https://docs.google.com/file/d/0ByutPv2Z36izcWstcmotWWx2aHM/edit?usp=sharing
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I've uploaded it to the beta server. Good job. The lighting is much easier on the eyes. Only things I see now are some minor texture alignment issues:
- Textures on some of the ladders should be rotated.
- Some of the crate and barrel textures don't line up quite right.
There were a couple other little ones. I'll try to put together a demo when I have some more time, but I may not be able to before I go out of town. Also, I'd like to play test it again to give some better feedback.
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I'll test it on the beta server when I have the time but I think this is pretty much ready for final.
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Played a small 3v3 lan game. Biggest issue I see is that I can consistently go from flag to flag in <10sec with the ice jump from the base, and then using the enemy ice jumps to get to enemy flag. It wouldn't be an issue if any other path didn't take 20+ seconds. I could cap on people before they even made it to my flag, which seems kinda questionable for a map of this size.
On a positive, it's completely different than most other maps being played right now. I think the pubs would love it. Matching would probably be impossible, there's just too many small passages and options. Overall, one of the more creative maps made in a while. Good luck with the final.
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Played a small 3v3 lan game. Biggest issue I see is that I can consistently go from flag to flag in <10sec with the ice jump from the base, and then using the enemy ice jumps to get to enemy flag. It wouldn't be an issue if any other path didn't take 20+ seconds. I could cap on people before they even made it to my flag, which seems kinda questionable for a map of this size.
On a positive, it's completely different than most other maps being played right now. I think the pubs would love it. Matching would probably be impossible, there's just too many small passages and options. Overall, one of the more creative maps made in a while. Good luck with the final.
Could you please give me a demo of ice jumping from flag to flag in under 10 seconds? I'd like to know so I can somehow alter that path.
I designed this map and New York primarily for the pubs.
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Could you please give me a demo of ice jumping from flag to flag in under 10 seconds? I'd like to know so I can somehow alter that path.
I designed this map and New York primarily for the pubs.
Sure, I'll do it later tonight.
Edit: Well, didn't get a clean run on either of the two fast options. But here's two of different really fast methods. One uses the ice. The other uses the ramps. I think one of them was about 11 seconds.
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Thanks Ace! Fortunately most people on the pubs don't have those kinds of jumping skills, so this likely will not be too much of a problem.
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Thanks Ace! Fortunately most people on the pubs don't have those kinds of jumping skills, so this likely will not be too much of a problem.
Shouldn't that be even more of an incentive to fix it, though? If most people can't do it, that means when one player that can do those jumps gets on, he'll completely "break" the game and make it not fun for everybody else.
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Shouldn't that be even more of an incentive to fix it, though? If most people can't do it, that means when one player that can do those jumps gets on, he'll completely "break" the game and make it not fun for everybody else.
My though process as well. Could add a few small walls to just break up some of the extremely fast routes.
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Attached a demo with some more suggestions. Just minor things.
After watching Ace's demo, I don't think those paths are as bad as I imagined them being. I can take other routes that are within a couple seconds of those, so it doesn't seem super unbalanced.
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I actually played this map and the one thing I couldn't stand was there being only one way to grab the two flag, once you grab it and go towards one you are completely trapped, you should make it so you can get over the wall back to two if needed.
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Which version did you play? The latest one has several paths to 2.
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Well, I mean if you grab the 2 flag and go out towards one you are screwed. There should be another way out of there if you decide to go up the ramp.
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Well, I mean if you grab the 2 flag and go out towards one you are screwed. There should be another way out of there if you decide to go up the ramp.
That problem has already been fixed.
My only question to y'all is: You don't mind if I make the secret/end room more...uh... visually noisy, do you? I'm talking about adding a 2nd set of strobe lights at the bottom and a pair of flowing nr_road in the middle.
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Yeah lazers pub must of had an older version.
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Yeah that one day I had it was like b2 I think because I never had the b4/b5 version yet.
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Just had a game with spec on this map, very fun.
Points: Not so confusing anymore, we hadnt played this map and it was easy relitively to pick up. GJ still some work imo though.
Secondly some spawn seem unfair to me especially the forward PGP ones and you have to go back and get some, I like the autocockers at mid though because you can run there.
Very fun especially with the bases, lots of routes but easy to play, intense.
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BBD, #sPec# just played 4s, this was tie. Awesome map, really good fun :)
First time we played the map, was a risk for us, but we wanted a challenge. The map is very original and the gameplay is very nice! Lots of jumps and ways, although I would highly, highly recommend adding arrows to direct you to flag 1 and 2.
The only thing with this map, it may be hard to become known, because it's so 'weird', but not in a bad way.
So nice to play a fresh map with good gameplay, just maybe add navigation and it will be great!
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In my humble opinion, "original" and "fresh" would be better adjectives than "weird". Lol I remember Clipz saying stuff about how new mappers always have a high opinion of themselves. It's true guys!
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I played a 4v4 on neon yesterday and it was just awesome!
I think this map is ready for final.
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Neon Beta 13 is now here!
-made neon magenta lighting closer to purple
-reduced lag by adding hint brushes and eliminating use of other neon colors besides blue and purple
-improved navigation
-made the secret room even more strobey (requires hr4/nr_road.jpg from the BASEBALLDUDE texture pack)
-requiredfiles: pics/mapshots/beta/neon_b13.jpg
This will go final shortly if nobody has constructive critical feedback for me.
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0ByutPv2Z36izS1ppLTNiaFJDblk/edit?usp=sharing
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Sorry for the delay, finally got it uploaded.
Didn't have time to look at it long, but it still has a bunch of the minor texture misalignments I pointed out in the last beta.
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I'm getting this map ready for final so I'd like to have some more feedback please.
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it still has a bunch of the minor texture misalignments I pointed out in the last beta.
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Thank you everyone who has given me feedback. Many people are telling me that Neon is ready for final, and I think it's pretty much there. In beta 14, which can very possibly become final, I have changed the lighting and (finally) reduced the size of the neon textures.
Please make sure you have the most recent BASEBALLDUDE texture pack (included in the .zip file) because I have changed several of the hr4 textures including all neon textures, especially neonmag and credits01 (although that texture doesn't apply to this map). I also changed the mapshots for both neon and new york.
Now I must address the texture misalignments that jitspoe pointed out. I have not gotten around to fixing those and probably never will because I have determined that they are too minor to significantly hurt the map's overall state and it would be too tedious and time-consuming to fix them.
The map is also on my new server, West Side CTF.
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0ByutPv2Z36izSlRHS0pwQWJLTU0/edit?usp=sharing
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Umm... your (;)) West Side CTF doesn't show on the server list for me. I've updated and refreshed lots.
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OK the server should be up and running, let me know it it's not.
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I have decided that this release will not be final as I have decided to tweak the lighting again. I might also get around to fixing those ladders.
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Neon Beta 15 is probably final. I have fixed all major misalignments (the ladders) and adjusted the lighting a little more. I'll just attach the BSP file this time because everything from the BASEBALLDUDE texture pack is exactly the same as it was last time.
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0ByutPv2Z36izZS11VVhZRGMyNEk/edit?usp=sharing
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AwSoMe MAP!
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First Screenshot:
Just a misaligned brush.
Second Screenshot:
In most places, you've made the neon tube come right to the edge of the wall (Top Middle), but in this hallway you've stopped about 16 units from the end(Middle Right).
Third Screenshot:
I'm not sure if this is a misalignment or if you wanted the bridge like this. (The gap). Thought I may as well attach it.
I've played it a few times and I must be getting old or something because my eyes do not like all the neon colours, haha.
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I don't like the way this strip of neon ends. Make it curve into the wall or something.
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I've fixed the bugs Rick pointed out plus some self-discovered misalignments. Beta 16 is
most likely final.
LaZeRs, all of my tunnels end like that and I don't think that's a big concern.
Beta 16: https://drive.google.com/file/d/0ByutPv2Z36izVU92N3BTYWh1cVk/edit?usp=sharing
Final: https://drive.google.com/file/d/0ByutPv2Z36izelNWWWd6QUhXcVk/edit?usp=sharing
You can also find this on West Side CTF.